Revisiting Core Attributes, More+Simple = Fun.

[Malpheas]

What I might like to see done is life and energy added as a result of putting pints into the three core stats; and not directly changed by using attribute points.

Let's say -

Putting points into a mastery meant you chose that mastery's perks (as well as downsides). Each mastery has a primary attribute - Cunning, Physique, or whatever...

When you add to that primary attribute you gained life and energy, and this is on top of putting points into the mastery itself.

eg. Hunting's primary attribute could be cunning.

Every point into cunning (only the invested points), gave you life and energy in balanced amounts.

This is ONLY applied to your first mastery chosen - REGARDLESS of whether you take a second mastery and inconsequential of the second mastery choice.

EDIT - wow ninja'd by Medierra; the artful dodger... O_O

[ASYLUM101]

There's one way to fix the problem!

Boy man, that looks like one interesting setup... I can see all classes using every stat.

[eisprinzessin]

That wasn't really new information ... but we obviously needed a refresher on this ... on May 6th:

Originally Posted by medierra

My thought is that cunning describes your skill, training, and cleverness in combat both with physical weapons and magic. To that end it increases your damages, probability to hit, and critical hits.

Physique is your overall strength, dexterity, physical conditioning. It influences your ability to effectively wear heavier armor but also represents the agility with which you avoid attacks and being critically hit.

Spirit represents your energy and willpower. It allows you to wield more potent magical items and influences the rate at which you regain energy.

I'm also contemplating getting rid of the point allocation for both health and energy and then making it so that you gain a health bonus for every point in physique and an energy bonus for every point in spirit.

There's been the condensed version from Sep 1st, if you find above is TL;DR:

Originally Posted by medierra

Cunning - OA and bonus to all damages
Physique - DA, Health, and Req for heavy armor
Spirit - Energy, Energy Regen and Req to use certain "top grade" magic items / affixes.

... and I considered to update my signature.

[matthewfarmery]

once we hit alpha and have a lot of people experimenting, then would be the really best time to see this in action and how to tweak it father, theory is fine, and this is what this is, but once people starting testing, then we can say if something works or not, or needs enhancing, but talk is good, so far looks promising. but there should be room for improvement once the game hits alpha, but yes, it would be interesting to create some interesting classes, and see how the system effects them, but at this stage, lets not make it concrete until we see this in action

Edit

you know, in the upcoming alpha and beta releases, are the devs planning on allowing testers to freely remove attribute and skill points and assign them else where? and freely choose classes (even if their two classes have already been chosen? (so it will make it easier to test the above, especially will speed up testing of different class combos)

just a thought, of course this will be disabled in the final release, but it may help during testing

[Malpheas]

That's an interesting idea and one I hope they do not implement. If they do I have a feeling people will demand it be in the final release and will likely feel cheapened by their removal if so.

[matthewfarmery]

well it was an idea, but I do understand that people will demand it in the final release, WHICH SHOULD NOT HAPPEN!!!

I only suggest it to speed up testing of the core stats and skills, but if people ask for it at the final release, then it should not be in at all, as the problem with TQ, is that only later did you really see stats and skills really bloom. but if there is going to be testing of stats, to determine if they work, or how they effect certain classes or class combos, mess up and you will end up having to create a new toon to do so, but as I said its just an idea

so the devs can take it or leave it, but again this should not be in the final release anyway, apart from buying back skill points, which I hope does remake a return

[Malpheas]

You know,,

It is dangerous for a couple of reasons, one of which I have handy: Spoiling the player base.

I was also going to suggested packing up the alpha / beta with level 50 templates with unspent skill / attribute points. But this falls under the same fallacy; spoiling the player base.

I think that being a tester is a difficult priviledge to undertake, as you have to understand that nothing is permanent. People will be deterred from playing the game if they either A)have already done everything, or B)have their hard work taken from them.

Most people are just not cut out to being testers.

Please pardon teh "up hills both ways" speech, but you used to have to suck it up with your mistakes or make a new character. You cannot be perfect the first time around, which is a behavior gamers need to be broken of. NEED.

But, being as this world is supposedly too fast paced to stop and smell the roses, again.

/RANT.

And I TOTALLY agree, players should still be able to buy back skill points.

[matthewfarmery]

well I am a experience tester, hence the suggestion, and I know what you mean by not everyone is cut out to be a tester. I helped to beta test X3 Reunion, a very buggy game, and was during the beta stage, I think my NDA has expired, as I signed that yonks and yonks ago, but anyway, plenty did sign up, but only a handful really remained including myself, only a few testers really tested the short and iffy campaign, but ultimately the game was rushed, we were testing build after build, and the testers knew the game was getting rushed, plenty wasn't added until pretty late, then of course there were the bugs, and plenty off them. Including one that kept coming back, (anyone here remember a cartoon called the cat came back? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bETCusT5kNM trust me when I said this one bug was equally as annoying

but anyway, I also beta tested Sins of the solar empire, and a few other projects recently, but yes, not everyone is cut out to be a tester, its boring, repetitive , you end up a lot of the time trying to duplicate other people's bugs, along with your own, then to write out a good bug report that people can understand. Which I might add not everyone is good at, as if someone writes, "I found a bug, and I get it when I pickup an object at a town" and that's it, then people will be scratching their heads a lot, I also seen people sign up and want to be a tester simply so that they can use or play the program / game, but don't bother to report any bugs

trust me, I know what its like to be a tester, but I know where you are coming from, as you sound experienced yourself, as many people would take the suggestion at face value and think, its going to be part of the game, but its not there to be part of the game, but to help test things better.

but anyway, I do take your points, and after what you say, its probably a bad idea, maybe the option could be enabled for certain players who are worthy and are genuine to help beta test? again another suggest, but yes, learning from your mistakes is part of the gameplay experience, that is true

but depending on how long the alpha and beta cycles last, we might have limted time to really test everything, hence the suggestion

but yes, I understand where you are coming from and this should not be enabled for most people as they may not understand why it was added in the first place and later will be removed

but anyway, Im looking forward to helping out, I have a genuine desire to help out and beta test this game, not just to play it before its really ready to be played, alpha I doubt will have everything in, and may take a lot of builds before its even playable (from a gameplay point of view) later once the game hits beta, then it should be a lot more fun

but anyway, the devs can take it or leave it, but if its not going to happen then fine, certainly there are valid reasons not to have it in or allow everything to have this

[Malpheas]

Yeah, totally. I wonder if the posted "alpha and beta" are not mysnomers and that they will have a formal beta test.

I remember Sacred, where they "beta" tested Sacred Plus v1.826; what a disaster that was.

As we get closer to release of pre-release versions, I get more excited at how it will be done.

[matthewfarmery]

Yes I'm wondering how the alpha and beta cycles will be done, maybe if possible, a IRC or similar chat system could be added? I have an old teamspeak 2 server 25 per room, that a few can use, if needed, as I allowed access to a friend of mine, but later he got a TS3 server, so mine wasn't needed anymore, mine will expire early next year, but if there is a need for it, I can renew it, just a thought

but a IRC channel would be a good idea as well, as there are a few to choose from and connect too, Icechat is a pretty simple IRC client to use, so that is another option, sometimes being able to talk direct is a lot easier then doing forum posts, especially reporting bugs

but anyway, just a few more suggestions