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  #391  
Old 02-14-2018, 04:02 PM
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MortalKombat MortalKombat is offline
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Originally Posted by sfbistimg View Post
Sorry but upheaval is the best aoe wps. Totem are a pathetic skill and I'll never use them. Zolhans is solid but only has 25% chance to proc, upheaval can have upwards of 40% with high oa.not sure where u get upheaval having only 100% weapon damage as mine is over 200% .
Opinions aren't fact so just because you believe upheaval is worst doesn't mean it is. MA is worst wps for 2h melee imo, again doesn't make it true.
Storm Totem covers an area about half the screen, even if enemies arent tightly clustered, chain lightning will hit them. Damage from several totems is more than enough to deal with smaller enemies in Crucible, without apending any time to chase them. When i say "best AoE skill", i mean that skill must have LARGE AoE, even if damage is mediocre. Yes, Feral Hunger (and other WPS) deal significantly more damage, but AoE is far smaller, and this is the reason why they arent as good.

Now, about Upheaval.
Upheaval's "% weapon damage" doesnt apply to main target. Main target for Upheaval ALWAYS get hit by 100% Weapon Damage. "% weapon damage" listed for Upheaval applies only to other enemies, that were hit by its AoE. In other words, against single target, Upheaval does NOTHING. But since its AoE is quite small, and its nature is RNG, it isnt really strong at dealing with large packs either.

I've played with this particular build. And i assure you, that it's greatest advantage over tons of other mediocre melee builds is STORM TOTEM! Most melee builds have poor AoE, and waste a lot of time chasing weaker enemies (especially ranged enemies). He can put up to 4 26-lvl Storm Totems, due to items and Stormreaver, so his AoE is unmatched for other melee builds.
At the same time, this build has an edge over tons of mediocre caster builds, because he can use his powerful melee attacks and ADCTH to deal with single tough enemies, and he does that VERY quickly too.
Melee and caster power combined - that's what makes this build good.

Of course, his tankiness isnt particulary high. Compared to my Forcewave build, he rather looks like a glass cannon for me. But let's be honest - my standards for tankiness are very high .
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  #392  
Old 02-14-2018, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by yper23 View Post
Since we're on the topic, if one did want to use totems as primary damage, can the transmuted ones compete with lightning at endgame (with items currently available)? I was thinking of the usual vit totems/sigil/devouring swarm combo but not sure if it's worth taking to 100.
I'm sure I saw a few excellent vitality builds, but they may be Conjurers, not Warders. HOEP THAT HALPS!


maybe here?

http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showt...ality+conjurer
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  #393  
Old 02-14-2018, 05:04 PM
yper23 yper23 is offline
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Originally Posted by Drokalypso View Post
I'm sure I saw a few excellent vitality builds, but they may be Conjurers, not Warders. HOEP THAT HALPS!

maybe here?

http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showt...ality+conjurer
Thanks, wasn't looking for a build though. I know vit conjurers are almost unkillable at endgame but haven't played one since before the xpac, so I'm wondering if they actually do decent damage now...it was almost as slow as retaliation before Mostly asking if corrupted totems can do comparable damage to lightning ones. Oh and totally forgot about Valguur's set.

*xpac not patch

Last edited by yper23; 02-14-2018 at 05:10 PM.
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  #394  
Old 02-14-2018, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by MortalKombat View Post
Storm Totem covers an area about half the screen, even if enemies arent tightly clustered, chain lightning will hit them. Damage from several totems is more than enough to deal with smaller enemies in Crucible, without apending any time to chase them. When i say "best AoE skill", i mean that skill must have LARGE AoE, even if damage is mediocre. Yes, Feral Hunger (and other WPS) deal significantly more damage, but AoE is far smaller, and this is the reason why they arent as good.

Now, about Upheaval.
Upheaval's "% weapon damage" doesnt apply to main target. Main target for Upheaval ALWAYS get hit by 100% Weapon Damage. "% weapon damage" listed for Upheaval applies only to other enemies, that were hit by its AoE. In other words, against single target, Upheaval does NOTHING. But since its AoE is quite small, and its nature is RNG, it isnt really strong at dealing with large packs either.

I've played with this particular build. And i assure you, that it's greatest advantage over tons of other mediocre melee builds is STORM TOTEM! Most melee builds have poor AoE, and waste a lot of time chasing weaker enemies (especially ranged enemies). He can put up to 4 26-lvl Storm Totems, due to items and Stormreaver, so his AoE is unmatched for other melee builds.
At the same time, this build has an edge over tons of mediocre caster builds, because he can use his powerful melee attacks and ADCTH to deal with single tough enemies, and he does that VERY quickly too.
Melee and caster power combined - that's what makes this build good.

Of course, his tankiness isnt particulary high. Compared to my Forcewave build, he rather looks like a glass cannon for me. But let's be honest - my standards for tankiness are very high .
I dont play this build, I play my own builds. With Upheaval, Avenger relic and counter strike I have very good aoe and with savagery my single target is more then strong enough to beat the game. I will never use storm totem as I don't enjoy that style of play. I also use no other wps other then Upheaval.
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Last edited by sfbistimg; 02-14-2018 at 06:14 PM.
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  #395  
Old 02-14-2018, 06:06 PM
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Originally Posted by sfbistimg View Post
I dont play this builds, I play my own build. With Upheaval, Avenger relic and counter strike I have very good aoe and with savagery my single target is more then strong enough to beat the game. I will never use storm totem as I don't enjoy that style of play. I also use no other wps other then Upheaval.
Then why (oh why oh why) are you chiming in with such heavy-handed 'advice' (as such) on this build? On another note, I don't know if you are aware, but typically internet protocol says that if you're going to be needlessly and vociferously pedantic, then your spelling and grammar games should be on-point.

Just an FYI.

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  #396  
Old 02-14-2018, 06:19 PM
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sfbistimg sfbistimg is offline
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Originally Posted by Drokalypso View Post
Then why (oh why oh why) are you chiming in with such heavy-handed 'advice' (as such) on this build? On another note, I don't know if you are aware, but typically internet protocol says that if you're going to be needlessly and vociferously pedantic, then your spelling and grammar games should be on-point.

Just an FYI.

I wasn't giving advice on the build. I just stated that upheaval isn't the worst wps in the game as both him and chthon stated. Then since he reponded and I was bored last night I started arguing. Tho No where did I give anyone advice at all about this build.
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  #397  
Old 02-14-2018, 06:26 PM
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Drokalypso Drokalypso is offline
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Originally Posted by sfbistimg View Post
I was bored last night I started arguing.
Yeah, that sounds about right.

Get some plants. Water them.

Or start a new thread for arguing about WPS.

Better idea; pick up a copy of Chicago Manual of Style and read about commas.

To get back on topic -

The combination of Storm Totem and Wind Devil (which people used to gripe about so, so much) is really fun. This is definitely one of those builds that doesn't look great on paper, but just sings in actual play if you like the kiting (well, dogsledding) style of play. Not quite a glass cannon, not really a tete-a-tete bruiser. It's just right!
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  #398  
Old Yesterday, 08:14 AM
ZeFXIII ZeFXIII is offline
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Thank you, great build. This was my first char / serious attempt at Grim Dawn, i gave up before because i only had complex build that required too many things etc. I've now played 50hours on the 2H lightning warder with full Ultos set (without weapon) and M. Stormreaver : this build is kind of 'slow' through the leveling process, but once i got the nice gear and augment i really enjoyend the end game stuff, being able to face tank almost anything, the only realy life threats are some Mages and nemesis than can still one shot me. Other than that : super strong, hit really hard with Savagery. I love it. I think it's good to mention that this build is really 'beginner/casual' friendly, that means a lot to many players, not only because it's accessible but also because you're not wasting your time following one of these builds that end up being efficient 20 % of the time if you press 5 buttons etc.. anyway thank a lot
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