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Old 03-22-2017, 07:37 PM
Halcyon Halcyon is offline
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Default All you need to know about conversion

Given the frequency of threads asking this or that question about conversion, I thought I would put together a thread with everything I know about conversion. I'm fairly sure I will make a mistake or two in here so if I do, please feel free to point it out and I will edit the thread to correct any issues.

Conversion: What it is and why you want it
Conversion is the process of changing damage from one type to another, such as from physical to chaos. It can be found in many forms, including equipment, buffs, and transmuters. The ability to convert damage opens up enormous potential for new builds and ways to stack damage of seemingly disparate types. Imagine a character using fire strike but all that fire damage instead turning into aether damage and being modified by a full set of gear that supports aether damage. The options are many and varied.

Order of Operations
Conversion occurs in a specific order of operations that can be best understood by this maxim "conversion happens first." The more detailed description can be found here and is as follows when using any skill.

"The order of events for Conversion is as follows: Base Skill > Skill Modifiers > Conversion on the Skill or Transmuter > Conversion on Equipment and Buffs > Equipment, Auras and Passives"

This means that when you use a skill, you start with its base damage, modify it by any effects of the skill itself, convert it through any transmuters or skill effects that are part of the skill itself, convert it through any equipment or buff effects, then modify it by your other buffs such as gear and passive skills.

Common questions
"Can I convert damage from procs?"
Yes you can, proc damage is treated as per any normal skill.

"Can I convert the damage from x skill into y and then convert y into z?"
No, conversion can never happen to the same damage twice. Damage that is converted in the 'skill or transmuter' stage cannot then be converted again in the 'equipment and buffs' stage of conversion.

"Will my conversion from x skill apply to damage from other sources?"
Yes, except if the conversion comes from transmuters or skill effects of active skills. The AAR transmuter only affects AAR, for example, not all sources of aether damage and discord only affects the damage dealt by cadence.

"But Solael's Witchfire has a transmuter that applies to other sources of damage!"
That's not a question Timmy, but the answer is because SW is a BUFF instead of an active skill. The modification to SW adds the term "x% physical converted to chaos" to the effects of the buff applied to the player, which then takes effect during the second half of the conversion step.

"Does the conversion on one weapon affect damage dealt by the other weapon while dual wielding?"
Yes, all conversions stack within a step.

"Speaking of stacking, how does that work?"
Conversions stack additively and are then weighted to fit a 100% scale. This means that if you exceed 100% conversion, excess conversion just changes the ratio of conversion. Example: if you have 100% physical to elemental and 50% physical to chaos, the system will weight it down to 67% physical to elemental and 33% physical to chaos to fit the 100 point scale.

Conversions from skills/transmuters do not stack with conversions from buffs/equipment though. To quote Evil_Baka who brought this to my attention "Taking Grenado and it's transmuster as an example, the 80% Physical to Lightning from Skyfire Grenado applies to the skill, then the 20% Physical left over is treated as 100% when sources from equipment buffs and anything that follows are taken into consideration."

"What about the order of operations? Which damage conversion happens first?"
Damage conversions happen simultaneously within each half of the conversion process, which is why they stack additively. You don't parse through all your types of conversion one by one, applying the effects in sequence. Instead, you add up the conversion types, weight it to 100 if necessary, then convert everything in one calculation.

"How does piercing work?"
Piercing is a separate type of conversion that happens after all other conversions are complete. It isn't even really a 'conversion' per se, but rather it's own mechanic known as armor piercing. If your conversion results in dealing no physical damage, maxed discord for example, then you will deal no piercing damage no matter how high your armor piercing percentage is.

"What's the deal with DoT? Does it convert?"
Yes, DoT converts as per its affiliated damage type. Frostburn converts whenever cold would convert, internal trauma converts when physical would convert, etc. If you have 50% physical to cold, 50% of your internal trauma damage will become frostburn. Aether and Chaos do not have affiliated DoTs.


In conclusion
Conversion is a versatile tool for stacking damage in your preferred damage types and can allow seemingly impossible class combos such as a pyromancer that deals aether damage or a spellbreaker that deals lightning damage. Learning to use it effectively will greatly aid you in your build designs and opens up a bunch of new possibilities for your playstyle. If anyone has questions or notices mistakes in this post, please feel free to post them as comments or to PM me so I can update the thread with the correction or answer the question.

Last edited by Halcyon; 03-23-2017 at 12:29 PM.
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Old 03-22-2017, 07:54 PM
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Evil_Baka Evil_Baka is offline
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Hopefully this'll mean less topics/questions about conversion .

Though, it might be worth making it clear that conversions from transmuters and conversions from skills or gear that would follow are not additive.

Taking Grenado and it's transmuster as an example, the 80% Physical to Lightning from Skyfire Grenado applies to the skill, then the 20% Physical left over is treated as 100% when sources from equipment buffs and anything that follows are taken into consideration. This is something that I did not know for a long time.

Making a note that Internal Trauma can be converted to other DoTs is an idea too.
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Old 03-22-2017, 08:10 PM
Halcyon Halcyon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evil_Baka View Post
Hopefully this'll mean less topics/questions about conversion .

Though, it might be worth making it clear that conversions from transmuters and conversions from skills or gear that would follow are not additive.

Taking Grenado and it's transmuster as an example, the 80% Physical to Lightning from Skyfire Grenado applies to the skill, then the 20% Physical left over is treated as 100% when sources from equipment buffs and anything that follows are taken into consideration. This is something that I did not know for a long time.

Making a note that Internal Trauma can be converted to other DoTs is an idea too.
Updated the post with both of these points, thank you for the input!
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Old 03-22-2017, 09:46 PM
DenisMashutikov DenisMashutikov is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Halcyon View Post
"What's the deal with DoT? Does it convert?"
Internal Trauma is the only DoT that converts and is treated as physical damage. Phys to cold, for example, would also convert an equivalent percentage of internal trauma to frostburn.
Not only Internal Trauma, but any DoT Damage Converts in the appropriate DoT if it exist.
For Example OFF Frostburn damage will convert to Burn using Warpfire, but will not convert using Decree of Aldrich.
(Also can check this post: http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showp...7&postcount=25)
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Old 03-22-2017, 10:12 PM
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Ceno Ceno is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Halcyon View Post
"What's the deal with DoT? Does it convert?"
Internal Trauma is the only DoT that converts and is treated as physical damage. Phys to cold, for example, would also convert an equivalent percentage of internal trauma to frostburn.
All DoTs can be converted. Note that Aether/Chaos do not have DoTs and conversion from one DoT to Aether/Chaos will not affect the DoT at all.
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Old 03-23-2017, 12:17 AM
Anunnaki Anunnaki is offline
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Thanks for this post. Just have a few questions. Let's say I wanted to convert CT to do full aether damage and I had a weapon that converts 50% elemental to aether and an amulet that converts 30% fire to aether. Will these both stack to convert 80% fire on CT to aether? Now let's say I use flame torrent devotion useing the same 2 items as above but with the duality rings that convert 100% chaos to aether. Will both these conversions work to make flame torrent do nearly pure aether damage? This last one might sound silly but let's say you can convert the chaos damage to aether on eldritch fire devotion does it convert the -chaos resistance also? Thanks alot fellas
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Old 03-23-2017, 02:04 AM
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FunkyGandalf FunkyGandalf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anunnaki View Post
Thanks for this post. Just have a few questions. Let's say I wanted to convert CT to do full aether damage and I had a weapon that converts 50% elemental to aether and an amulet that converts 30% fire to aether. Will these both stack to convert 80% fire on CT to aether? Now let's say I use flame torrent devotion useing the same 2 items as above but with the duality rings that convert 100% chaos to aether. Will both these conversions work to make flame torrent do nearly pure aether damage? This last one might sound silly but let's say you can convert the chaos damage to aether on eldritch fire devotion does it convert the -chaos resistance also? Thanks alot fellas
Resist reduction won't convert just the damage.

Everything else is correct i think.

On i side note, flame torrent has some burn damage which is not effected by the fire->aether conversion but only because aether damage doesn't have a dot equivalent.
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Old 03-23-2017, 04:26 AM
DenisMashutikov DenisMashutikov is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anunnaki View Post
Thanks for this post. Just have a few questions. Let's say I wanted to convert CT to do full aether damage and I had a weapon that converts 50% elemental to aether and an amulet that converts 30% fire to aether. Will these both stack to convert 80% fire on CT to aether? Now let's say I use flame torrent devotion useing the same 2 items as above but with the duality rings that convert 100% chaos to aether. Will both these conversions work to make flame torrent do nearly pure aether damage? This last one might sound silly but let's say you can convert the chaos damage to aether on eldritch fire devotion does it convert the -chaos resistance also? Thanks alot fellas
Oh, yes, one more remark about order.
Elemental conversion have priority over Fire/Cold/Lightning.
In specified example Elemental conversion applies first, then remaining Fire counts as 100% for further conversion.

Later today I'll try translate my post about skill damage conversion formula.

Last edited by DenisMashutikov; 03-23-2017 at 04:32 AM.
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Old 03-23-2017, 04:40 AM
Anunnaki Anunnaki is offline
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Awesome thanks alot fellas for answering those questions makes sense now
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Old 03-23-2017, 05:21 AM
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PrinceXavieR PrinceXavieR is offline
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I have a huge fetish for conversion builds.. thanks for putting this all up
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