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Old 12-07-2018, 09:44 AM
somnium somnium is offline
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Default Temper armor bonus

The armor bonus its gives seems quite weak. It only adds 88 armor when maxed and 186 with fully maxed ultimate levels. This only amounts to about a 5% or 10% (when Fully maxed) boost in armor. This seems wholly inadequate.

I suggest either boosting it by large amount and/or to add DA(which the Demolitionist sorely lacks) or to add phy res% in the same vein it was added to the Nightblade mastery.
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Old 12-07-2018, 09:49 AM
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It's big enough. It reduces physical damage by an additional 88/186 when you have 100% absorption, so it's rather big/huge. Other items can give you at max 8% armor, which in general would be about 80 - 152, depending on your armor values, with no devotion bonuses or skill bonuses.
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Old 12-07-2018, 10:38 AM
somnium somnium is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USER_NAME_01 View Post
It's big enough. It reduces physical damage by an additional 88/186 when you have 100% absorption, so it's rather big/huge. Other items can give you at max 8% armor, which in general would be about 80 - 152, depending on your armor values, with no devotion bonuses or skill bonuses.
Many Items can give more then 8%. Examples:
Mythical Shoulderguards of Justice
Mythical Titan Pauldrons
Stoneskin Girdle
Mythical War's Rebuke
And yes many only give 5-8% but considering you can wear many of these item with "only" a 5-8% bonus, I don't thinks its right to have maxed ultimate skill to only give around the same or less armor then 1 or 2 armor pieces might give

Many sets give also give a 10-20% bonus in amor value in addition to bonuses its individual components might give.

Even Seal of Blades has a 8% armor bonus. Having a component give far more armor or slightly less in the case of 2H as side benefit compared to a maxed ultimate skill is again not okay in my opinion.

The solider skill adds 28% to armor. Sure this is one of the main draws to the class but I don't think the difference should be quite this drastic.
Other skill that boost the flat amor, those from the Shaman and Nightblade mastery also have higher values, being 104/250 and 124/264 respectively

Last edited by somnium; 12-07-2018 at 10:43 AM.
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Old 12-07-2018, 10:46 AM
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Okay, so my bad with the 8%, didn't remember there are some that give 8+, but then:
Field command needs 32 points, 20 to unlock, 12 to max, for 28% armor and 86 OA and DA, 185 energy reserve,
Temper increases damage and retaliation damage too, with one more point to spend. 50 energy reserve.

Temper is damage focused, Field command is defense focused. 88 armor is enough, no matter how you look at it. |At max levels (overcap), it's 182 and 33%. Also, Temper's bonus is increased by any % armor increase, so with Temper at 22, and FC at 22, Temper gives 242,06 armor. Add devotion bonuses to that, which can increase your armor by a huge amount.
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Old 12-07-2018, 12:36 PM
somnium somnium is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USER_NAME_01 View Post
Okay, so my bad with the 8%, didn't remember there are some that give 8+, but then:
Field command needs 32 points, 20 to unlock, 12 to max, for 28% armor and 86 OA and DA, 185 energy reserve,
Temper increases damage and retaliation damage too, with one more point to spend. 50 energy reserve.

Temper is damage focused, Field command is defense focused. 88 armor is enough, no matter how you look at it. |At max levels (overcap), it's 182 and 33%. Also, Temper's bonus is increased by any % armor increase, so with Temper at 22, and FC at 22, Temper gives 242,06 armor. Add devotion bonuses to that, which can increase your armor by a huge amount.
Even if you stack a few % armor boost at maxed temper it will still not be that much more, unless you play a build that focuses on getting the armor value as high as possible to the detriment of everything else. In with case it will indeed be valuable as the large amount of % will substantial increase the value of the flat armor bonus and devalue armor % due stacking so many of them.

An example calculation with a 60 % armor bonus:
(took only shoulder armor to make the calculation easier)
boost by armor bonus 1666 x 1,60 = 2665,6
add temper boosted by armor bonus % 2665, 6 + 291,2 = 2956,8
which is the equivalent of an armor bonus of 2956,8/1666 = 1,775 for an 1,775-1,60 = 17,5 % armor bonus added at 22 skill points due temper. At 12 skill points the armor bonus temper would be equivalent to would be 8,5 %. Still not that good

But this is only under the assumption that you play a (physical) commando, that can stack multiple % boost via Field command, devotions and gear.
What if you play an others build that needs more physical defense. Most will only have access to amor % bonus via gear and some devotions but many of them only fit shield wearing builds and thus will be sub optimal.

For example Sorcerer/purifier/elementalist builds that converts physical damage to Fire, lighting, elemental or other damage types would find value in the flat damage but not much use in the armor bonus it gives.
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Old 12-07-2018, 02:13 PM
hammyhamster1 hammyhamster1 is online now
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Quote:
At max levels (overcap), it's 182 and 33%
Comparing it to Inquisitors:
  • AoC: 18% reduced total ALL damage at 12/12 and 25% reduced at 24/12
  • -->Inquisitor Seal: 200 absorption of everything at 12/12 and 445 absorption at 22/12
considering temper only impacts physical through armor...
(as well as BWC only impacting 18% pure physical)


If going the "don't nerf my build" route, then this would highly suggest that Demo's Temper could use something. Even with a pierce purifier you are unlikely to see many skills invested into Temper (even if Temper was improved) -due to alternate inquis choices.

Last edited by hammyhamster1; 12-07-2018 at 02:37 PM.
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Old 12-07-2018, 05:07 PM
mad_lee mad_lee is offline
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Well, Demolitionist is the worst mastery atm, no wonder. I think Temper's armor bonus is almost useless. I would rather it be something like stun resistance.
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Old 12-07-2018, 06:28 PM
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Temper only good on Sharzul+Justicar builds, when you can push %armor to 4K and convert that dmg to something usefull, or on phyz builds when you can capitalize on %phyz dmg bonus. For everyone else temper is not worth more that one point and on most caster builds not worth even one point.
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Old 12-07-2018, 07:45 PM
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In comparison to Oak Skin or Phantasmal Armor. Well yeah, it's the worst of the 3 per point investment when it comes to Armor.

Raising it to 10 armor per point investment and having that increase to 12 at higher levels would not be a bad idea.
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Old 12-08-2018, 04:46 PM
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Buffing armor on Temper would only benefit builds that are already defensively strong. The only builds I’ve played that max it are beronath or firewave commandos because this investment benefits them for different reasons. Builds that need that armor usually have no points to spare (Firestrike puri, BwC sorc, Darkblaze pyro, etc). You wouldn’t be investing there just for the sake of armor anyway no matter how much you buff it.

Last edited by ya_; 12-08-2018 at 04:53 PM.
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