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Old 02-12-2019, 06:20 PM
Saw's Avatar
Saw Saw is offline
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Originally Posted by somnium View Post
Cadence is massive outlier in terms of the setups and damage types its supports. I could use the same argument for nearly any skill (including Fire Strike). Franky I would disagree with the notion that any skill should support any damage and weapon setup equality well, that would result in a rather bland game IMO. I would rather see Cadence nerfed then for Savagery to be buffed to such levels as well.

On topic:

Its true in my expedience that that 1H Melee savagery(just like fire strike) is a bit too terrible compared to 2H and dualwield melee but the crux of the issue in my eyes is not so much a lack of damage but that non solder classes cannot take much advantage of the defensive properties of a shield.

I think it's fine that 1H builds deal less damage in general then dual wield and 2H builds. Nor do I see it as a problem that cadence is better for 1H compared to Fire strike and savagery as different skills can and should specialize in different things. Not everything should be the same, different skills and combat styles should have their own strengths and weaknesses IMO.

The problem occurs when basically you lose decent chuck of dps and gain a rather negligible amount of defense in return, making it not so much a trade of but more like a penalty.
This is case for most non soldier builds when they op to use a shield. Comparing s&b with 2H and dual wield its seems to me that there is a clear imbalance how useful the combat styles are outside the mastery that boost them. Imagine how restrictive the game would be if 2H and dual wield melee had a similar game balance in that they would be nearly useless outside of the shaman and nightblade mastery respectively.
Melee Firestrike being bad needs it's own thread, let's focus on Savagery in this one.

I'm not saying that every skill needs to support every damage type (though it seems with every update that Crate actually wants us to experement, giving us more and more conversion options, correct me if I'm wrong), but having auto-attacks that support every weapon set-up WILL increase the overall build diversity. I also haven't said anything about making 1h and 2h weapon set-ups equally powerful, I just stated that in most cases (not all) 1h Savagery isn't strong enough to be good for the endgame, imho.

Speaking about the S&B, let's take a Lightning Warder as a good example. He has all the shield support that he can get and also has Savagery. But I haven't seen a good Warder that is actually using S&B Savagery since pre-AoM. Simply because S&B Cadence even does the lightning damage type better (with the latest patches) than Savagery does. They shouldn't do equal damage or anything, but the should be both viable for the end-game. In this case, Savagery increasing OA and DA isn't very helpfull, because the actuall thing everybody is looking for in an AA is damage. And nerfing Cadance won't solve this problem, it will just leave us with 3 weak auto-attacks.
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Old 02-12-2019, 09:27 PM
Avyctes's Avatar
Avyctes Avyctes is offline
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Originally Posted by somnium View Post
Cadence is massive outlier in terms of the setups and damage types its supports.
It should be noted that this isn't because of a design decision, but the fact that converting physical damage into any other type is very easy. Converting, for example, lightning to any other damage type is a lot more difficult . I think it's not a bad estimate to say that at least half the unique weapons in the game support converting physical damage to something else. The options to convert other damage types can usually be counted on one hand, and often don't reach full potential even if they exist.
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