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  #31  
Old 10-13-2018, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Jaknet View Post
Try playing the same char from scatch, but pure self found and not using any previously found gear and see how easy that is.
I always play self found, don't use gear from other characters while leveling. After beating ultimate I throw on gear to run crucible or to farm AoM content. Again acts 1 thru 4 are a joke difficulty wise.
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  #32  
Old 10-14-2018, 12:03 AM
idontwannaknow0 idontwannaknow0 is offline
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Originally Posted by Norzan View Post
Because Nemesis is a rank and some being clearly weaker than others is inconsistent and doesn't make sense from a design point.

Besides the human faction Nemeses, which have reduced loot drops because how easy they are to find, all Nemeses have the same loot quality in their troves. So, why would someone risk fighting a stronger Nemesis instead of the weaker ones, even though they have the same loot quality? Difficulty should be the same as reward and right now, fighting Valdaran, Moosilauke and Benn is much easier than fighting Grava or Reaper.

And Alkamos will continue being the weakest because mutators are also in other rogue dungeons.
The reward being the same doesn't strictly make sense sure but Nemesis are not always something you actively go out of your way for though (even if you do the reward is underwhelming given the average search time and opportunity cost of getting more loot from other Main Campaign content). A player can encounter Grava farming rylok MI medals and that player is entitled to refuse to engage because the "reward is the same as easier Nem so not worth it" but the player hasn't found an easier Nem and so the reward from Grava will just be lost. Doesn't make sense here.

Mutators will apply everywhere but each Rogue boss have their own unique drops, Grove has ugdenbloom and various MI gears etc. Plus FG is adding the unique set too so it's not a problem incentive wise.

There will also always be some inconsistency. Why would a person farm Janaxia or Avris over Twin Falls hive if TF is easier and faster? or run a long way to kill a4/5 tomb bosses? A person is free to calculate and decide the most efficient/easy way to farm and then spam it but if they complain about being bored they only have their own choice to blame.
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  #33  
Old 10-14-2018, 12:08 AM
Norzan Norzan is offline
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It doesn't really matter what the player is doing, either farming specific or anything else, risk vs reward should be the same for all Nemeses and there's a clear inconsistency here. This is made worse by the fact that a lot of HC players are clearly not gonna risk more dangerous Nemeses if they know their loot is the same as the weaker ones.

And people farm Hive runs because bee heroes are way weaker than Janaxia or Larria. Which pretty much mirrors the same inconsistency with Nemeses. Except here is fine because these enemies are not in an exclusive tier, populated by very few enemies.
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Last edited by Norzan; 10-14-2018 at 12:14 AM.
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  #34  
Old 10-14-2018, 12:29 AM
idontwannaknow0 idontwannaknow0 is offline
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Originally Posted by Norzan View Post
It doesn't really matter what the player is doing, either farming specific or anything else, risk vs reward should be the same for all Nemeses and there's a clear inconsistency here. This is made worse by the fact that a lot of HC players are clearly not gonna risk more dangerous Nemeses if they know their loot is the same as the weaker ones.

And people farm Hive runs because bee heroes are way weaker than Janaxia or Larria. Which pretty much mirrors the same inconsistency with Nemeses. Except here is fine because these enemies are not in an exclusive tier, populated by very few enemies.
Well you said yourself you are accustomed to slaying Grava so you propose a difficulty increase? I'm sure there would be others opposed to difficulty increases too. Personally if anything must be done at all then I'd prefer a raise in the reward quality for AoM Nem.
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  #35  
Old 10-14-2018, 12:42 AM
Smitherson Smitherson is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Norzan View Post
Because Nemesis is a rank and some being clearly weaker than others is inconsistent and doesn't make sense from a design point.

Besides the human faction Nemeses, which have reduced loot drops because how easy they are to find, all Nemeses have the same loot quality in their troves. So, why would someone risk fighting a stronger Nemesis instead of the weaker ones, even though they have the same loot quality? Difficulty should be the same as reward and right now, fighting Valdaran, Moosilauke and Benn is much easier than fighting Grava or Reaper.

And Alkamos will continue being the weakest because mutators are also in other rogue dungeons.
Except that finding Benn and to a lesser extent Valdaran is a massive pain compared to Grava, Aleks, or Reaper. Grava actually has about as many spawn spots as Fabius. You can probably do 3-4 full Grava runs in the time it takes to find Benny once.
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  #36  
Old 10-14-2018, 12:54 AM
Norzan Norzan is offline
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Originally Posted by Smitherson View Post
Except that finding Benn and to a lesser extent Valdaran is a massive pain compared to Grava, Aleks, or Reaper. Grava actually has about as many spawn spots as Fabius. You can probably do 3-4 full Grava runs in the time it takes to find Benny once.
Their loot shouldn't be determined by how hard or easy they are to find except for extreme cases like Fabius, Zantarin and Iron Maiden. Kubacabra also is a pain in the ass to find since they decided to put him in the Ancient Grove. And he's harder than all vanilla Nemeses.

Valdaran actually got piss easy to find since they removed several spawn spots. He only shares the same issue with Kubacabra because he also can be inside of a rogue dungeon.

And with Grava, you actually have to kill Ekket'Zul if you want to reach the other side in case Grava hasn't spawned anywhere else. I mean, he's not hard, but at least it's more than Fabius and Iron Maiden.

Quote:
Originally Posted by idontwannaknow0 View Post
Well you said yourself you are accustomed to slaying Grava so you propose a difficulty increase? I'm sure there would be others opposed to difficulty increases too. Personally if anything must be done at all then I'd prefer a raise in the reward quality for AoM Nem.
Definitely not an increase of difficulty, but definitely an increase in loot quality for AoM Nemeses.
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Last edited by Norzan; 10-14-2018 at 01:09 AM.
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  #37  
Old 10-14-2018, 07:02 AM
ya_ ya_ is offline
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Let me forego quoting as Iím using a mobile phone and itís a pain.

(to the developersí spokesman) Thereís no such thing as truly finishing a build unless you GDStash or have thousands of hours in the game. MC is PROBABLY not gonna get a Nightmare Mode but not because devs ďdislike endless progressionĒ (bs) but because it doesnít pay.

(to the self-found gear enthusiasts) In my experience, people who insist on building with gear self-found in MC and refuse to trade, when asked about Crucible, they blush and say they donít like it.

(to the opponents of difficulty increase) If you think MC is hard youíre doing something wrong (which is totally normal for the first walkthrough btw). Ultimate is actually the easiest with access to faction stuff, components and finally to endgame gear. At lvl 94 nothing in MC can touch even my solo mastery builds (been playing around with solo soldier and inquisitor for added challenge - still no challenge). This isnít bragging or complaining - just stating an obvious fact.

The reason why I started this thread is because devs spent hundreds of hours designing endgame gear and seem to have overlooked that there is no place for most of that gear in MC! Modding... Yeah but I like to stay legit and trade legit. Why not incorporate one of the mods into the base game, tweak it a little, add a few achievements on Steam and make it totally optional? In theory, would such a move be possible in the gaming industry?
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  #38  
Old 10-14-2018, 07:04 AM
They Live They Live is offline
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Behind these requests of more difficulty all i see is "hey watch me i'm hardcore". I think difficulty in this game is in a fair spot, want a challenge? Try hc.
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  #39  
Old 10-14-2018, 07:27 AM
ya_ ya_ is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by They Live View Post
Behind these requests of more difficulty all i see is "hey watch me i'm hardcore". I think difficulty in this game is in a fair spot, want a challenge? Try hc.
Thatís not that. It sounded more like: ďhey watch me Iím hardcore cause I do hc.Ē Many of the very top builders donít do hc. Itís just not for everybodyís nerves. Personally, I wanted to try it but the thing with separate stash has been putting me off.
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  #40  
Old 10-14-2018, 07:36 AM
medea fleecestealer's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ya_ View Post
Let me forego quoting as Iím using a mobile phone and itís a pain.

(to the developersí spokesman) Thereís no such thing as truly finishing a build unless you GDStash or have thousands of hours in the game. MC is PROBABLY not gonna get a Nightmare Mode but not because devs ďdislike endless progressionĒ (bs) but because it doesnít pay.

(to the self-found gear enthusiasts) In my experience, people who insist on building with gear self-found in MC and refuse to trade, when asked about Crucible, they blush and say they donít like it.

(to the opponents of difficulty increase) If you think MC is hard youíre doing something wrong (which is totally normal for the first walkthrough btw). Ultimate is actually the easiest with access to faction stuff, components and finally to endgame gear. At lvl 94 nothing in MC can touch even my solo mastery builds (been playing around with solo soldier and inquisitor for added challenge - still no challenge). This isnít bragging or complaining - just stating an obvious fact.

The reason why I started this thread is because devs spent hundreds of hours designing endgame gear and seem to have overlooked that there is no place for most of that gear in MC! Modding... Yeah but I like to stay legit and trade legit. Why not incorporate one of the mods into the base game, tweak it a little, add a few achievements on Steam and make it totally optional? In theory, would such a move be possible in the gaming industry?
Everyone plays the game differently. For me, my character is done when I finish Ultimate no matter what gear they have. I'm not interested in having BiS and just don't farm, it's not my thing. My goal is finishing the game, that's it.

As for finding Ultimate easy, that may be the case for you, but most likely not the majority of players who reach it. I've only completed it once and while it wasn't horrendously difficult, it also wasn't easy. And remember we're talking about that 2.1% of people who even play Ultimate once or more.

As for incorporating mods into the game, this is from the stream of the 14th September. It's regarding ingame storage, but the principle is the same.

"IMayBackstab: @CrateEntertainment any plans to assimilate some of these inventory/stash mods for a 5 or 10 dollar fee? Your players would be happy to spend that while also not splintering the player base as much with mods.

I mean the people who have created these utilities for you guys have done them from their own free will for free and us basically taking that and charging money for it seems very unfair to them. And from our development perspective we have design decisions for why the bags are limited as they are. It is not just arbitrarily limited to screw you guys over, there are genuine reasons why that isn't the case. But for those of you who want more stash space, that is why we allow modding and that is why you can use those utilities so you can have as much space as you want and because they work outside of the game they don't splinter the player base. You can't only play with people who use GDStash or GDIA, like you can play with everybody."

The Shattered Realm being an endless dungeon will allow you to push your characters to the limit which seems to be what you want to do. Also the new mutators in the challenge areas will help the difficulty issue as well.

As said, there are several mods which increase the difficulty of the game so give them a try. You can also challenge yourself by using only yellow or even just white items, go completely Naked (weapon/shield only), get into speed running, etc. If you want to be really masochistic you could try Grimarillion naked. Because given the clamour for a reduction in the number of difficulties we already have and the difficulty of doing that, it's pretty clear another one isn't going to be added.
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