#21  
Old 11-20-2017, 09:49 PM
eisprinzessin's Avatar
eisprinzessin eisprinzessin is offline
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Fair enough - I shall push FoI a bit faster than I would use to and find my sweet spot for energy usage. And you are right, Blitz is important in my build, but this is partly due to our different devotion choices.

I never considered ADctH and so far I have not missed - interesting though.
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  #22  
Old 11-20-2017, 09:52 PM
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Chthon Chthon is offline
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Originally Posted by eisprinzessin View Post
Do you find the skill has diminishing returns on higher levels, or is it just too weak and points should go into FoI and Blitz? My main concern was to get a decent OA, as I do not have any item collection I can rely on.
The skill is pretty good but after level 4 I think the scaling is different and also due to the on crit nature of the skill I generally leave it at level 4 and only invest beyond that level when I have spare points
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  #23  
Old 11-20-2017, 10:02 PM
bystander bystander is offline
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The skill is pretty good but after level 4 I think the scaling is different and also due to the on crit nature of the skill I generally leave it at level 4 and only invest beyond that level when I have spare points
I typically do the same. It's usually just 1 point, and have the +'s take care of the rest. I find it hard to invest on a skill to give more crits, when it takes a crit to activate it, and it is only up half the time at best.
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  #24  
Old 11-21-2017, 06:39 PM
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Here we go eis, just hit 20. A lil slow going cuz I am leveling another build too.

Level 10
http://www.grimtools.com/calc/w26Jq802
Level 20
http://www.grimtools.com/calc/nZoW8kvZ

Of note: I handled Salazar and Gutworm pretty easily. The hardest part was on the Salazar fight my mind freaked out on the controller a lil bit and got confused about what I should be pressing vs. what I was pressing and I made some mistakes but I managed to regain my cool and after that it was easy sailing.
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  #25  
Old 11-21-2017, 08:37 PM
toazd toazd is offline
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Originally Posted by eisprinzessin View Post
Rune of Kalastor is certainly fitting, but I'm not sure if I am comfortable with adding a seventh active skill to my char. Let me know how it works for you.
I removed it for the same reason and have yet to try using it again (and my bar is not even full - I just don't like reaching for 7 to 0 - I should really rebind the keys). My wife and I did get the chance this past weekend to do the Crucible together and I got to level 30. I kept pushing to go higher and higher because I am very confident this character will go far. Her Blademaster build struggled even though I tried to keep the Inquisitor seal under her character and heal her with Word of Renewal . I will definitely go higher and set yet another personal record on this character when I get the chance . This might be the first character I finish the campaign with so I am slow to progress while I meticulously read everything, explore everywhere, and generally enjoy the ride. Additionally, I really enjoy "farming" for the variety and subsequently "min-maxing" my character with everything that I find.

Edit: Level 30: http://www.grimtools.com/calc/O2GlYknV

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Originally Posted by Chthon View Post
Don't bother with it. It's too weak in Ultimate. The final Canister Bomb like explosion is the only thing good about it

Quite generous of you to make a progression guide such as this

How are the energy costs treating you and is Markovian's Defense worth it for you?

Btw level 4 Deadly Aim would serve well even in end game, might want to move those points
Thanks for the heads-up about your experience with Rune of Kalastor late game.

With regards to Deadly Aim: Using the "Damage Per Hit" section of the second character sheet tab I am under the impression that Deadly Aim applies its' bonuses to other skills only when I wield a gun. Can you shed any light on this?

Last edited by toazd; 11-21-2017 at 11:09 PM.
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  #26  
Old 11-21-2017, 08:42 PM
bystander bystander is offline
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Originally Posted by toazd View Post
I removed it for the same reason and have yet to try using it again (and my bar is not even full - I just don't like reaching for 7 to 0 - I should really rebind the keys). My wife and I did get the chance this past weekend to do the Crucible together and I got to level 30. I kept pushing to go higher and higher because I am very confident this character will go far. Her Blademaster build struggled even though I tried to keep the Inquisitor seal under her character and heal her with Word of Renewal . I will definitely go higher and set yet another personal record on this character when I get the chance . This might be the first character I finish the campaign with so I am slow to progress while I meticulously read everything, explore everywhere, and generally enjoy the ride. Additionally, I really enjoy "farming" for the variety and subsequently "min-maxing" my character with everything that I find.

Edit: Level 30: http://www.grimtools.com/calc/O2GlYknV



Thanks for the heads-up about your experience with Rune of Kalastor late game.

With regards to Deadly Aim: Using the "Damage Per Hit" section of the second character sheet tab I am under the impression that Deadly Aim applies its' bonuses to other skills only when I wield a gun. Can you shed any light on this?
Deadly Aim works for any skill no matter what you wield.
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  #27  
Old 11-22-2017, 10:57 PM
toazd toazd is offline
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Originally Posted by bystander View Post
Deadly Aim works for any skill no matter what you wield.
Can you be more specific about what you mean when you say it "works?" More importantly, can you please present evidence to support your statement?

To expand on and be more specific about what I typed: The character sheet indicates that the %Elemental damage bonus from Ranged Expertise only applies to other skills when I wield a gun or crossbow. I did not check the character sheet to see if the same applies to the flat pierce damage (for skills that use %Weapon damage), the %Pierce damage, and %Attack speed.

I've tried searching this forum and beyond for an official word or evidence as to which way the skill is intended to function and how it actually does function but I've only come up with conflicting statements that seem to be only conjecture.

If only the tool-tips were more precise and to a lesser degree consistent. For example, color coding and explaining in a help tool-tip local versus global modifiers but I digress.

Last edited by toazd; 11-22-2017 at 11:02 PM.
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  #28  
Old 11-22-2017, 11:01 PM
bystander bystander is offline
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Originally Posted by toazd View Post
Can you be more specific about what you mean when you say it "works?" More importantly, can you please present evidence to support your statement?

To expand on and be more specific about what I typed: The character sheet indicates that the %Elemental damage bonus from Ranged Expertise only applies to other skills when I wield a gun or crossbow. I did not check the character sheet to see if the same applies to the flat pierce damage (for attacks of course), the %Pierce damage, and %Attack speed.

I've tried searching this forum and beyond for an official word or evidence as to which way the skill is intended to function and how it actually does function but I've only come up with conflicting statements that seem to be only conjecture.

If only the tool-tips were more precise and to a lesser degree consistent. For example, color coding and explaining in a help tool-tip local versus global modifiers but I digress.
1) Deadly Aim gives absolutely no description that even hints that it is limited to ranged weapons.
2) When I use on my FoI build, which uses a 1h dagger, Deadly Aim is procing often. My DPS goes up when it does, my OA goes up, and I see the icon above my head.
3) The buff shows up above the UI on the left as well.

For the most part, if a skill does not specify that it only works with a specific type of weapon, or offhand, it works for all weapons. If it doesn't specify that it only works on default weapon attacks, it works for all attacks. That said, +damage modifiers only apply to weapons, unless otherwise specified.

Last edited by bystander; 11-22-2017 at 11:05 PM.
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  #29  
Old 11-23-2017, 12:29 AM
toazd toazd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toazd View Post
With regards to Deadly Aim: Using the "Damage Per Hit" section of the second character sheet tab I am under the impression that Deadly Aim applies its' bonuses to other skills only when I wield a gun. Can you shed any light on this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bystander View Post
1) Deadly Aim gives absolutely no description that even hints that it is limited to ranged weapons.
2) When I use on my FoI build, which uses a 1h dagger, Deadly Aim is procing often. My DPS goes up when it does, my OA goes up, and I see the icon above my head.
3) The buff shows up above the UI on the left as well.

For the most part, if a skill does not specify that it only works with a specific type of weapon, or offhand, it works for all weapons. If it doesn't specify that it only works on default weapon attacks, it works for all attacks. That said, +damage modifiers only apply to weapons, unless otherwise specified.
I sincerely apologize because I made a late-night mistake!

When I responded to Chthon's post with "With regards to Deadly Aim..." for some reason I thought s/he was typing about "Ranged Expertise" and I even typed the wrong thing! Oh wow...I think I need to set a dead-line at night at which time I can no longer type anything but only read .

Well, to contribute something from my mistake: I noticed that the character sheet damage for Rune of Kalastor is increased by points in Ranged Expertise but only while wielding a ranged weapon. As a relative "noob" this was enlightening to me because the global nature of the bonus (and others like it) isn't explained in game that I am aware of. For whatever reason, I initially assumed that those bonuses on skills applied to only those skills unless stated otherwise.

Last edited by toazd; 11-23-2017 at 12:43 AM.
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  #30  
Old 11-23-2017, 01:43 AM
bystander bystander is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toazd View Post
I sincerely apologize because I made a late-night mistake!

When I responded to Chthon's post with "With regards to Deadly Aim..." for some reason I thought s/he was typing about "Ranged Expertise" and I even typed the wrong thing! Oh wow...I think I need to set a dead-line at night at which time I can no longer type anything but only read .

Well, to contribute something from my mistake: I noticed that the character sheet damage for Rune of Kalastor is increased by points in Ranged Expertise but only while wielding a ranged weapon. As a relative "noob" this was enlightening to me because the global nature of the bonus (and others like it) isn't explained in game that I am aware of. For whatever reason, I initially assumed that those bonuses on skills applied to only those skills unless stated otherwise.
That part is only partly going to apply. The damage % will apply, but the +damage part won't.

But ya, I started to wonder if you were thinking about Ranged Expertise in some fashion.
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