#21  
Old 07-21-2015, 08:18 PM
Grohuf Grohuf is offline
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What did I do wrong? I verified everything possible in game about them, and went with the game guide on them. It's not helpful to just say I did something wrong without saying or exaplaining what.
You have different assumptions in different parts of you guide. You was confused by own formulas
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  #22  
Old 07-21-2015, 08:45 PM
Raiyaz Raiyaz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grohuf View Post
First you need to simplify formulas. You are writing guide.
PTH = 85 + (OA - DA) / 15
Each 15 OA/DA difference give you 1% PTH
I have no idea what system of math you're using, but it must not be standard. This is why you need to show your work.

Code:
PTH=((((OA*5)+7500)–(DA*5))/75)–15                 | Start
PTH=((5*(OA+(7500/5)-DA))/75)-15                   | Factor out 5 in the Numerator
PTH=((OA+1500-DA)/15)-15                           | Multiply where needed from previous step.
PTH=(15/15)*(((OA+1500-DA)/15) +((15/15)-15)       | Multiply by common denominator (15)
*Note for next step I forgot to write out in initial math: ((15/15)-15) = -(15*15)/15
PTH=(OA+1500-DA-(15*15))/15                        | Combine numerators over common denominator
PTH=(OA+1500-DA-225)/15                            | Multiply -(15*15)
PTH=(OA-DA+1275)/15                                | Subtract (1500-225)
So your real simplified formula is PTH = (OA-DA+1275)/15. If you want to be a stickler, you can factor out (-1) and end with PTH=-(DA-OA-1275)/15, but I don't think that step is neccesary.

I didn't simplify this out in the guide because I figured it was unneeded, although perhaps you are right, I should add it in. I don't know why it should take you four posts just to say that though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grohuf View Post
Second, REAL crit chance formula is:
mod = 100 if PTH <= 100
mod = PTH if PTH >= 100
(well, or "int mod = (PTH <= 100) ? 100 : PTH" if you like c++)

crit chance = (PTH - 90) / mod * 100%
Why do you add new term "mod" without explaining it? People shouldn't need to decrypt what you're trying to say.
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Last edited by Raiyaz; 07-21-2015 at 09:11 PM. Reason: Put math in [code] for easier reading.
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  #23  
Old 07-21-2015, 09:01 PM
Grohuf Grohuf is offline
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Why do you add new term "mod" without explaining it? People shouldn't need to decrypt what you're trying to say.
I do not need "explain" something. It's just value. Some number which I gave name. I named it "mod" because it's short version of "modificator".

Quote:
So your real simplified formula is PTH = (OA-DA+1275)/15. If you want to be a stickler, you can factor out (-1) and end with PTH=-(DA-OA-1275)/15, but I don't think that step is neccesary.
(OA - DA + 1275) / 15 = 85 + (OA - DA) / 15
It's not some sort of differential calculus where you can make mistake and need to explain.

Quote:
I didn't simplify this out in the guide because I figured it was unneeded, although perhaps you are right, I should add it in. I don't know why it should take you four posts just to say that though.
15 OA for each 1% PTH - this is exactly what you need to say in such guide.

Also such guide should give player estimation how much dps he will recieve for each 1% PTH (or 15 OA)
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  #24  
Old 07-21-2015, 09:03 PM
gabfou gabfou is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiyaz View Post
I have no idea what system of math you're using, but it's clearly not standard. This is why you need to show your work.

PTH=((((OA*5)+7500)–(DA*5))/75)–15 | Start
PTH=((5*(OA+(7500/5)-DA))/75)-15 | Factor out 5 in the Numerator
PTH=((OA+1500-DA)/15)-15 | Multiply where needed from previous step.
PTH=(15/15)*(((OA+1500-DA)/15) +((15/15)-15) | Multiply by common denominator (15)
*Note for next step I forgot to write out in initial math: ((15/15)-15) = -(15*15)/15
PTH=(OA+1500-DA-(15*15))/15 | Combine numerators over common denominator
PTH=(OA+1500-DA-225)/15 | Multiply -(15*15)
PTH=(OA-DA+1275)/15 | Subtract (1500-225)

So your real simplified formula is PTH = (OA-DA+1275)/15. If you want to be a stickler, you can factor out (-1) and end with PTH=-(DA-OA-1275)/15, but I don't think that step is neccesary.
PTH=(OA-DA+1275)/15
PTH=(OA-DA)/15 + 1275/15
PTH=(OA-DA)/15 + 85
PTH = 85 + (OA - DA) / 15

love your guide but maybe you can add this "Each 15 OA/DA difference give you 1% PTH" in note
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  #25  
Old 07-21-2015, 09:05 PM
Grohuf Grohuf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabfou View Post
PTH=(OA-DA+1275)/15
PTH=(OA-DA)/15 + 1275/15
PTH=(OA-DA)/15 + 85
PTH = 85 + (OA - DA) / 15

love your guide but maybe you can add this "Each 15 OA/DA difference give you 1% PTH" in note
Thx mate. It's too simple for Grohuf to explain.
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  #26  
Old 07-21-2015, 09:27 PM
doublebuck doublebuck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiyaz View Post
What did I do wrong? I verified everything possible in game about them, and went with the game guide on them. It's not helpful to just say I did something wrong without saying or exaplaining what.
This formula is wrong:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiyaz
PTH=CH+(CC-10) [ONLY IF CC IS GREATER THAN 10, OTHERWISE PTH = CH]
Let's quickly test it with example values from the game guide:
Quote:
Example: PTH = 132, 1-90 hits, 91-109 critically hits for 1.25x damage, 110-129 critically hits for 1.5x damage, 130-132 critically hits for 1.75x damage
According to your formula:
132 = PTH = 100 + (42/132*100 - 10) = 121,82

In your Moosilauke example the real PTH is given by 90/(1-CC) = 108.04 etc.

Grohuf gave the correct formula for CC, you can turn it around to get PTH.
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  #27  
Old 07-21-2015, 09:38 PM
ex cathedra ex cathedra is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiyaz View Post
n Reduced Target's Resistance is absolute and cannot be stack with other n Reduced Target's Resistance debuffs. Examples include: War Cry, Plaguebearer's prefix.
this sounds a little misleading. in a sense, those debuffs certainly can stack; while only the largest source is applied at any time, all of the various small sources available from your gear (e.g. plaguebearer's adept's spellblade with two marks of dreeg) applies as a single 70+ point debuff.

decent start, i'll be impressed when you explain attack speed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grohuf View Post
(well, or "int mod = (PTH <= 100) ? 100 : PTH" if you like c++)
cc = (PTH - 90) / max(100,PTH) * 100;

Last edited by ex cathedra; 07-21-2015 at 09:45 PM.
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  #28  
Old 07-21-2015, 09:51 PM
Grohuf Grohuf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doublebuck View Post
Grohuf gave the correct formula for CC, you can turn it around to get PTH.
Always right...

But in any case. Normal guide is needed. So I hope sometime you will write correct one (and full)

Quote:
cc = (PTH - 90) / max(100,PTH) * 100;
You are cheating...
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  #29  
Old 07-21-2015, 10:01 PM
Raiyaz Raiyaz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ex cathedra View Post
this sounds a little misleading. in a sense, those debuffs certainly can stack; while only the largest source is applied at any time, all of the various small sources available from your gear (e.g. plaguebearer's adept's spellblade with two marks of dreeg) applies as a single 70+ point debuff.

decent start, i'll be impressed when you explain attack speed.
One day. No one understands attack speed.

I'm just going to insert your quote about the resistances, into the post. Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by doublebuck View Post
This formula is wrong:
Let's quickly test it with example values from the game guide:

According to your formula:
132 = PTH = 100 + (42/132*100 - 10) = 121,82

In your Moosilauke example the real PTH is given by 90/(1-CC) = 108.04 etc.
Grohuf gave the correct formula for CC, you can turn it around to get PTH.
Hey you explained it, hallujuah!

Thanks for taking the time and effort everyone for explaining this to me. Both of these things and the reduced resistance below negative example are now added.

EDIT: We are aware that the two formulas are equivilent, right? 1-(90/PTH) is just the same as (PTH-90)/(PTH*100%), but with 100%=1, and PTH factored out. There's nothing I can be missing about this, unless if you're all saying the *100% means something other than multiply by 1.
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Last edited by Raiyaz; 07-21-2015 at 11:45 PM.
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  #30  
Old 07-21-2015, 10:40 PM
MeatHeadMikhail MeatHeadMikhail is offline
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Didn't see this thread till now. Played over 1k hours of TQ, but still learned something from this. Will read more later. Bump for ya, thanks!
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