Bias and the ever present agenda

[sevrun]

I think we can all agree that humans in general are biased creatures. Einstein once commented on just how a person's view of someone's intelligence was inevitably linked to how closely their views match our own. His intent wasn't to say that we think people who disagree are all stupid (but sometimes we do if we're honest with ourselves) but that we will inevitably think more highly of the intelligence of those who agree.
So if every person is biased, then clearly every group of people is also biased. Some moreso than others as support of the group's agenda can be a determining factor for being a part of said group. So how can you best discover a particular group's agenda and biased view of the world? Look to what they say, how they say it, and above all, watch them when the cameras _aren't_ rolling and they aren't posing for the crowds. Knowing the truth about history doesn't hurt either, which can be easily accomplished by turning your attention to the original historical documents of the period in question. Why not your basic textbook? Because someone has gone through and decided what was or was not important enough to be in the book. This is their opinion of importance, and opinions are biased. Why bring up educating yourself? Because that is the only way to know who wants to use you and who wants to help. I made my choices in that regard a long time ago, and I was wrong on a lot of them because I didn't educate myself well enough.

I can go on and on along these lines, but I've already provided enough for people to pick apart little phrases to twist, or purposefully misunderstand. But a few things to keep in mind while twisting.

I have not indicated any single group as more biased than any other, that would defeat the point. Educating yourself about history is never a bad thing, as it gives you a perspective to see where the world is going for yourself instead of relying on someone else's viewpoint. If you'd care to discuss individual views, and are capable of doing so in a civil fashion without resorting to the typical talking points that have become a refuge against unbiased discourse, then feel free to get my attention, as I am always curious to learn more about people, and to share what I have learned already.

[Void(null)]

I agree with everything you said I think you are a very intelligent individual.

[shawnmck]

Personally, I believe some biases are prefectly okay, whereas others are not.

For example, it is not acceptable to be biased towards ayone based on age, sex, skin color, ethnicity, religion, sexual preference, etc...

But I feel its okay to be biased in terms of social conduct. I am biased against people who rape, murder, steal, lie, take advantage of others, & etc.

But yeah, there is a lot of bias around. Whether it is about a particular genre of game, console maker (Sony vs Microsoft), or especially political, there is still a lot of senseless bias.

However, I feel that certain biases are acceptable (in certain circumstances), otherwise we would be walked all over by people who want to do us harm. Why be nice to someone who beat his wife or child, or to someone who likes to set defenseless animals on fire?
As a society we make what is acceptable & what is not.

I just think it is a fallacy and incorrect to place a broad picture of all bias being bad, when some bias helps keep social order (to an extent). Not liking criminals is a bias. Hating child molesters is a bias. Thinking drugs are bad is a bias. I could go on.
I know that is not what you did, but some might interpret it that way, and I wanted to express my opinion that some forms of bias are okay, and yet they are still bias.
I personally dislike the way some people act as if bias of any kind is bad and should not be tolerated, which I think is a very arrogant attitude to have.
If we can't have some forms of bias then we aren't really FREE. Yet at the same time, some forms of extreme & irrational bias (against race, religion, sex, etc) are totally bad and damaging.
Painting a picture of bias in general as being bad is not accurate, but there has to be some boundaries. I would not want to live in a world that is devoid of all forms of bias, because then chaos would eventually rise, as people would be tolerant of all kinds of horrible behavior.

[shawnmck]

But I do agree with your post/topic...
There is a lot of bias out there, & people need to be aware of it & sift through it to filter out some of it to get a better picture as to the motives behind it.
As we are are a people of bias, so are we people of motivations. Some of them not so clean or good willed, but selfish and arrogant.
But for the most part, I think people are mostly good, with the occasional scum that needs to be trampled beneath our boots. But even good intentions can have bad outcomes.

[Llama8]

Originally Posted by sevrun

Knowing the truth about history doesn't hurt either, which can be easily accomplished by turning your attention to the original historical documents of the period in question. Why not your basic textbook? Because someone has gone through and decided what was or was not important enough to be in the book. This is their opinion of importance, and opinions are biased.

What is historical truth? Original historical documents can be just as biased as those written later. Personally all I think the closest you can get to historical truth is historical events & then view those through whatever biases you have.

[ZZSmufa]

Religion is not something one is born with. Maybe a preference for belief, but no one exact set of beliefs. Therefore it is justified to bias against people who act unethically, even if they have a religious reason behind it. The freedom of religion grants everyone a right to choose, but choices have consequences.

One should never be persecuted for their beliefs, but others certainly have the right to question a person's mental integrity if they choose to believe in something far-fetched. Of course the response shouldn't be out of proportion, and in general it is far better to evaluate a person based on their actions rather than their beliefs. However, one's thoughts and ethical framework gives insight how one might act, and thus naturally biases the observer somewhat.

I agree that people are biased creatures by default, and that is something we just have to work with. As long as we are capable of introspection and can find at least some reasonable, and preferably logical, proof for our thoughts and feelings, we are able to spot our biases and take necessary precautions to not let them dictate our actions.

[sevrun]

lol thanks guys, for the constructive input... most places I could have posted that would have merely started a flame war. In response to shawnmck... you're correct in asserting that bias in and of itself is neither good nor evil. It simply is.
For example, I grew up with loaded firearms in my home. I knew where they were and how to use them responsibly, so I have a very negative bias against the idea that I should rely solely on the police for protection in my home. I view it as good to be armed, others may (and have at times) viewed it as a very bad and potentially unhealthy thing... for them. After all, we're all born biased in favor of survival.

Although I must admit, ZZSmufa... you have managed to cover my intended point far better, and faster, than I did.

[shawnmck]

Originally Posted by sevrun

lol thanks guys, for the constructive input... most places I could have posted that would have merely started a flame war. In response to shawnmck... you're correct in asserting that bias in and of itself is neither good nor evil. It simply is.
For example, I grew up with loaded firearms in my home. I knew where they were and how to use them responsibly, so I have a very negative bias against the idea that I should rely solely on the police for protection in my home. I view it as good to be armed, others may (and have at times) viewed it as a very bad and potentially unhealthy thing... for them. After all, we're all born biased in favor of survival.

I completely agree, and know what you mean.
If I had to wait for a police response while being robbed or murdered then I would be already robbed or dead by the time they arrived. I know they want people to just give up their belongings to whatever criminal that comes their way, but I was raised to defend myself. And I will, even if I have to do it with a stick.


BTW
My girlfriend has been raped once before, & a 2nd attempt was unsuccessful (Thank GOD). So I bought her a small can of mace with a grip for her to keep in her purse, even though they are illegal to have where I live. That way she can defend herself. She is aware of the risks, and is willing to take them in order to defend herself. She is not going to let any rapist have their way with her again while she lays still hoping that the police will somehow do something. She would rather fight & be killed than go through that again. And if they don't kill her then she claims she will at least be more at ease knowing she tried.
I really take offense to the way some would tie the hands of the law-abiding citizen to be able to defend themselves. It is taking power away from them that just exasterbates the mental stress that accompanies any such attack.
We (anyone) may be a victim, but we shouldn't have to feel like one.

[shawnmck]

Speaking about "bias"...
Anyone watch the movie "Knight & Day" with Tom Cruise and Cameran Diaz?
I personally thought it was a fantastic movie. Maybe not all that original, but I enjoyed every minute of it.
However, I do take issue with the very condecending articles that have appeared knocking Tom Cruise. One was titled, "Tom Cruise a flop", which went on to describe how Tom Cruise is no longer bankable since he decided to jump on Oprah's counch....WTF? The article was an obvious hit piece designed to ridicule Tom Cruise for being Tom Cruise (a man who really loves his wife, and who is a Scientologist). The article was just one insult after another about Tom Cruise.
Further down the Yahoo article I found quite a few people who responded just as negatively, stating how they will never support any movie by a Scientologist, or how Tom Cruise is an "idiot" because he jumped on Oprah's couch.
This really pisses me off, because they are in effect trying to affect his movie carreer in a negative way, simply because of their bias against Tom Cruise.

A previous article did a similar thing, but also mentioned that if Knight & day doesn't do well that the producers behind Mission Impossible 4 are going to pull the plug.
There are actors that I don't like either, but I don't go around talking negative about them in an attempt to discourage people from seeing their movies. And no-one is forcing them to watch any of his movies.