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  • Grim Misadventure #17: Mini-map Update

    Welcome back to Grim Misadventures! Here to give you the latest on our nonstop push for alpha.

    The bits and pieces are all falling into place and there aren't too many more things remaining before we’ll be ready to make the big announcement. The boss is almost finished, we’re trying to address a couple annoying bugs, finish off the last skill work and make sure there are no major issues. Once we release, it would take a while before we could put out a patch, so we want to make sure the initial alpha build doesn't have major problems that could make parts of it unplayable – like an underground connection not working or some such thing. We are also trying to finalize our distribution arrangement and get everything set up.

    Because we’re busy finishing and fixing things for alpha, there isn't necessarily anything “new” to show you. However, we have one new feature that has arisen from your feedback that we would like to share.

    After the passionate response to our visual update to the UI, we investigated adding in the mini-map options people requested. Since we’d had the map in that top position previously, it didn’t require too much work to slip it in as an option and moving the location name was trivial. You can see them below:

    Top-Right (the dangers of capturing screenshots)

    Mini-map Hidden

    We also hear and understand the strong opinions some of you have expressed over health bars vs. globes. It is a tricky issue because there are both development limitations and gameplay reasons for us not having them at this point. In terms of gameplay, we felt that the stacked health and energy bar are the most efficient way to quickly see both resources at once, near the center of the action and provide the most accurate visual representation of how much health / energy you have left. The globes, by contrast, become a little harder to accurately gauge toward the tops and bottoms. There are also already complaints by some that the HUD protrudes too far into the play-space and globes would only cause it to protrude further.

    So, while some may prefer the aesthetic of globes, our feeling is that health bars serve gameplay and fit our setting best. We humbly request that you give the current iteration a try. Alpha is right around the corner after all.

    Beyond the gameplay considerations, it would actually be a fair amount of work to convert the HUD and add the functionality for globes. Some have criticized that our past HUD updates have just been “re-skinning” or moving around existing UI elements. These criticisms are entirely accurate because that is what we have been doing and that’s exactly what we said we were doing. From the start, we've said that we’re operating on limited resources and need to carefully target where we invest our efforts. Adding globes to our HUD would be a more significant change than the layout revisions and rework of art that we've undertaken so far. It isn't a huge task but it would take time away from other improvements or features we could be working on. We question whether it is worth that time to make an aesthetic change that just seems different but, at least to us, not necessarily better. It is definitely not something we can slip in for alpha but, once you have had the chance to play with our current HUD and provide feedback, we can see if there is a large demand for change.

    I think it is also important to consider that different people want to see different things. If there isn't a major demand to redo the HUD, we could always try to build in the functionality for globes so that it could be added in later as an option or done as a mod.

    I can’t wrap this up without an update from our warlocks! They too have been slaving away in the pits to bring you a sharpened image of our boss. I don’t think they quite got it yet though. Back to the pits, warlocks!

    All shall fear the ___

    This concludes our regular broadcast. Check back on 04/01/13 for the next Grim Misadventure. I swear it will be a real update.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by Zantai; 03-18-2013, 02:07 PM.
    ***Waste of Souls***

  • #2
    The reason we all (I) like the globes is because they are to the sides and it opens up the middle of the screen where all of the action is happening.

    I feel that the current HUD is ok but not great. Also it now looks lop sided.
    "When you play GD it will feel like being punched in the face by a drunk grizzly bear. Thats how awesome it is.

    ... wait is that awesome? ok, how about - its like you're drunk and a grizzly bear is punching you but... no wait... its like you're drunk, you punch a grizzly bear in the face but the bear is also drunk, so it just explodes into gibs."


    • #3
      You guys are awesome! The mini-map option is a great compromise, and personally I think it works MUCH better in the top right corner. I recognize others will disagree, but thanks for giving us the option to choose
      "I've always felt that a person's intelligence is directly reflected by the number of conflicting points of view he can entertain simultaneously on the same topic."


      • #4
        I've always been one for the globes but I think these will work great. I also think it looks great the way it is so it won't be an issue for me. In the end they both have their positives and negatives so no point wasting time on it when this works the way it is.

        I'm loving the quest UI! What's this Warden's Laboratory we'll be looking for? Will he be there when we find it?! I can't wait to find out! keep up the awesome work and thank you again for another update and some more awesome screen shots!
        Last edited by Caramon; 03-18-2013, 01:38 PM.
        0341 Death From Above


        • #5
          Enough with the globes! Just gimme teh alpha..


          • #6
            Can't wait

            First time poster, but I have been keeping up with this for a long time. Missed out on the Kickstarter, but am a Loyalist contributor.

            Honestly love what this studio is doing and wishing I had gone down the road of game programming instead of business/finance. The game looks amazing. I completely understand the point about the HUD and think bars not only serve the function, but feel almost nostalgic. The HUD has this Arcanum feel to it, and while that game was buggy as all get out I loved the feeling it had. Let Diablo keep the globes, especially if it means time to work on other things that push this game to the forefront of ARPGs. I mean, at least play the Alpha first before knocking it folks.

            Love the mini-map, good call there especially since the world is connected. Will make travel easier.

            Can't wait to get my hands on it!


            • #7
              This is, for me, the best update so far, Zantai! I had my concerns about the new (gold) HUD art at first, but here it looks really clean and, if you get my meaning, seamless. I thought it would stand out too much, but I now have a feeling I'm going to love it! Thankyou for yet another awesome update! Btw, I love how you can now see your active quests under the new minimap position (I like that as well )!

              @Caramon: I believe it's this: http://www.grimdawn.com/screenshots/...tory01_lrg.jpg
              [KS] Digital Collector's Edition + Expansion
              I wanted that massively stylish George Washington in-game powdered wig

              Salute of the Fallen HC Player
              Yet there is beauty in death! Ave, Grim Dawn, morituri te salutant!


              • #8
                Originally posted by Younghappy View Post
                Good call Younghappy! I forgot about that screenshot.
                0341 Death From Above


                • #9
                  I think the UI looks great and it doesn't take up as much room as people claim it does.

                  Sure, it's not a single line of skills, like TQ was, but you can either have a plain UI or a fancy UI. And as Zantai said, globes would have just taken up even more room. Plus, as he said, it might me something that can be an option or mod later, if you want to add globes.

                  I would rather the game mechanics be rock solid for alpha release, especially since it may be awhile before a patch, than to be wasting time constantly trying to make everyone happy with the UI.

                  Can't wait to play the alpha!
                  Legendary Key Holder since February 2010

                  Kickstarter Contributor - Hoarder's Edition - 5/2/2012


                  • #10
                    I don't think everyone is going to rise up with pitchforks and torches over health/mana globes missing.

                    Although I do agree with Chameleon, where the health/mana bars are right now makes it feel a bit lobsided.

                    Have you guys thought about implementing a scalable interface within frames? Think Warhammer Online or other games with a movable interface.

                    Edit: I suppose you guys could just extend the health/mana bars all the way across the hotkeys. But for alpha testing purposes, it looks pretty good.
                    Last edited by violentbydesign; 03-18-2013, 03:00 PM.


                    • #11
                      UI looks clean and I have absolutely no problem with bars vs. globes. It's actually really well made and the gold wheels on the side are really aesthetically pleasing if you take a good look at them.

                      Can't wait for alpha.
                      They told me "never fall in love it never works out in your favor, you're way too young and right now that's just human nature".


                      • #12
                        Develop the interface as you guys see fit... and let the mod community develop mods that will allow us to carve and tweak and make the UI our own.

                        If you guys try to do everything to please everyone

                        1) the game won't be out until some time 2015
                        2) the mod community will have absolutely nothing to do!

                        "Sleep with one eye open, gripping your pillow tight."
                        proud owner of both a Loyalist and Patron Edition key.


                        • #13
                          I'd have to agree that the UI does look a bit lop-sided but (at least on the screenshots) it blends nicely into the scenery.


                          • #14
                            Hah, yeah... it is a bit lopsided but that was a result of taking a chunk out so we could shift the mini-map and location name to the top right.

                            We could have filled that in with a bigger block of art to even it out but were afraid people would see it as unnecessary filler cover the screen (which it would be). To do something else like have the energy bar slide over would have been a lot of extra work and this was something we were trying to slip in on the quick before alpha.


                            • #15
                              I too think it is somewhat lopsided. It's not a big deal, but seeing as the camera is centered on the PC, and the UI is not, it feels off after looking at it for some time. Problem is, that I can't think of a easy fix.
                              You could raise/add something to the right part, which would make the UI even bigger (not that I think its too big) and block even more things or move the bars to the top left corner.
                              I know, I know, they were moved to the bottom so that you don't have to look to the corners all the time, but I don't thinks its that bad. The minimap is also in on of the top corners and most people want it to be there. Why not the health/energy bar? I really like that about TQ. I remember I installed a mod once where they moved those bars to the bottom. and it took me some time to get used to it, I often forgot to check my HP and almost died.
                              But whatever, I'm sure you'll find a solution, most likely way better than anything I could think of. And as already mentioned, there's always the mod-way .

                              On an other note: I'm not sure if I like those gold ornaments at the sides. Don't get me wrong, it is way better then the old, plain one, but you always go on about Cairn being a dark, almost (post-)apocalytpic world, where resources are rare and you have to take what you can get. And I really like the look of, for example the merchant or character window. The background really adds a lot to the atmosphere with the grayish color, the cracks and well, everthing. You're not running around in a shining silver armor because there is no such thing.
                              Considering that, why do we have gold ornament like things now? I don't really care about the color, I just think it's to shiny. That's what I think anyway. It still looks cool, but I think it draws some unnecessary attention.

                              All shall fear ... THE PIXELS!

                              Edit: Meh, just saw you're preply medierra. Excactly what I though and I just wanted to add that the lopsidedness is not something major. If it's too much work, it wouldnt be worth the effort and time. I'd much rather have an alpha with as few bugs as possible than a perfect UI.
                              Last edited by Khashayar; 03-18-2013, 02:45 PM.
                              FOR THE EMPEROR!

                              Stephen Hawking : "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."