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  • I bought a Legendary Key and would definitely appreciate a Steam key with it.

    Humble Bundle has a nice system where you can download the game directly from them or activate a Steam key and add the game to your account.

    I want to see Grim Dawn on every site; Steam, GOG, GG, etc.!!!!!!
    AMD Phenom X4 975 3.6//ASUS M3A78-T//8GB DDR2-1066 RAM//GTX 660//Asus Xonar D2X//Crucial C300 64GB SSD//Windows 7 x64//Alpha Tester

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    • I recently caught GOG. Self hate steam because the Internet is not always there. In addition, the use of steam somehow involves DRM.
      P.S: I hope to make up long ago because it would achieve progress for consolers.

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      • Originally posted by varsovie View Post
        The fact is steam is in such a monopoly position that GD should be offered on their market to sell well. And even without DRM, if you buy on their store, you need Steam to download it. And that's a big obstacle for me since their services aren't the most reliables in the world nor the fastest.
        Well Steam is just about the fastest and most reliable digital distribution service there is, plus as mentionned previously, it has an INSANELY GOOD join / invite system for multiplayer.

        Plus it gives grim dawn insane exposure, even if only a small portion of the steam users actually buy the game, it makes it so the game is seen and talked about.
        That alone justifies the 30%, while it may sound like alot, it's really not all that much when it gives you the opportunity to have your game seen by millions of people, and not jsut anyone, gamers.

        How else do you advertise your game? TV ads? Crate surely does not have the money.
        Various website Ads? surely not as profitable for the investment.

        Fact and matter is, Steam will generate much more revenue than the loss of the 30% per game involves.

        And also as mentionned previously, Steam =/= DRM. MANY many games, bought on steam, and downloaded on steam, can be ran, without even having steam oppened on your PC, not even in offline mode, just off.
        Currently playing : The Pit : Sword of the stars / Dota 2 / Don't Starve / Age of Empires 2 : Forgotten Empires / Dishonored / Antichamber

        Steam Username : Skellt

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        • This thread keeps popping up again and again with disturbing frequency. I think now that the KS funding is secured, Crate should soon come forth and clarify some aspects. They said "DRM free". That means for me that there will be a version without Steam. The problem is that many say Steam is not DRM or it is a soft one . For me it is DRM and that's the end of the story. For me a "DRM-free" promise means I'll have the option to choose a non-Steam version. Think a GOG version.

          I have no problem with Crate making a Steam version. I have a problem with labeling it "DRM-free".

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          • Originally posted by nbringer View Post
            This thread keeps popping up again and again with disturbing frequency. I think now that the KS funding is secured, Crate should soon come forth and clarify some aspects. They said "DRM free". That means for me that there will be a version without Steam. The problem is that many say Steam is not DRM or it is a soft one . For me it is DRM and that's the end of the story. For me a "DRM-free" promise means I'll have the option to choose a non-Steam version. Think a GOG version.

            I have no problem with Crate making a Steam version. I have a problem with labeling it "DRM-free".
            So let's see
            You buy from steam, download the game from steam then play while steam not even being open.

            You buy off Crate's website, download the game from the website and play offline.

            How is either of the two DRM and how is one more DRM than the other?
            Currently playing : The Pit : Sword of the stars / Dota 2 / Don't Starve / Age of Empires 2 : Forgotten Empires / Dishonored / Antichamber

            Steam Username : Skellt

            Comment


            • @Skellt
              Simple:
              -nobody can guarantee now that I'll be able to buy from Steam in my country (this is really annoying).
              -if Steam dies or suspends my account, or I get hacked I have no game(s) anymore (plain DRM, by staying between me and Crate, Steam has the rights and ropes to do anything with my stuff; if you don't see it, then I rest my case)
              -I can only install the game if I install the client
              -I can not install the game while off-line (by the way, Crate, if we get the game from you, do we get a 2Gb *.exe installer or a 2Kb "you need to be online" one!?)
              -I can not handle the patching myself therefore I have to be online whenever the client wants to update "something" even though I don't want to update anything at that moment (it's like I have a car and I'm forced to go check it every 10000km...)
              -I want to play LAN/online without Steam. I don't like your attitude: "You buy off Crate's website, download the game from the website and play offline." Please note the correct way: "You buy off Crate's website, download the game from the website and play.".

              Again, I have no problem with Crate making a Steam version. I have a problem with labeling it "DRM-free".

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              • nobody can guarantee now that I'll be able to buy from Steam in my country (this is really annoying).
                That i have nothing to say about as it is not nor never will be my case, and that could suck

                if Steam dies or suspends my account, or I get hacked I have no game(s) anymore (plain DRM, by staying between me and Crate, Steam has the rights and ropes to do anything with my stuff; if you don't see it, then I rest my case)
                If you get hacked you have means to take back what is yours, if you get banned, there is a reason and that is yours to blame, but the no game part is not entirely true

                I can only install the game if I install the client
                That is true

                I can not install the game while off-line (by the way, Crate, if we get the game from you, do we get a 2Gb *.exe installer or a 2Kb "you need to be online" one!?)
                You need to download the whole game, so more than likely a 2GB exe or a downloader in the likes of Blizz, but the prior is more likely

                I can not handle the patching myself therefore I have to be online whenever the client wants to update "something" even though I don't want to update anything at that moment (it's like I have a car and I'm forced to go check it every 10000km...)
                That is false, you can do patching as you like with steam, you can let it do as it wish or do it yourself.
                I have some of my games set to patch when i tell them to and some that update automatically

                I want to play LAN/online without Steam.
                Having Steam =/= NEED to have steam to play / play online / play LAN

                I don't like your attitude
                Its not about attitude, its just about making people see that.. in the end, Steam is really not the big devil some might see it as.

                And there are alot of misconceptions about what Steam actually does, and most of what you stated can be done with steam or without it.

                Again, i am not saying that the game should not have a website downloadable game.
                The point is, downloading GD from this website and from steam really does NOT make much of a diffrence.

                And what i wanted to clear up with you isnt that you are right or wrong or should NOT have that opinion, mearly to clear up what you seem to consider steam as.

                And i do NOT mean to offend you, this is a healthy discussion and each is entitled to its own opinion and i respect them
                Currently playing : The Pit : Sword of the stars / Dota 2 / Don't Starve / Age of Empires 2 : Forgotten Empires / Dishonored / Antichamber

                Steam Username : Skellt

                Comment


                • It is worth bearing in mind to the users that do not approve of DRM measures, or Steam for their own valid reasons that having a game on Steam is not the same as having a game tied down with Steamworks.

                  Yes, some games will require Steam as a mandatory install. Skyrim, Civ V, Shogun 2 are such examples. Further can be found here.

                  However many games can be sold on Steam, amongst many other distributors. There is nothing stopping Company X to place a game for sale on Steam, Impulse, Gamers Gate, your local bricks and mortar store. A game that is for sale on Steam and GamersGate for instance, and purchased from GamersGate which does not have Steamworks can be run without Steam.

                  When Crate said their game will be DRM free, I would then believe myself that Grim Dawn will not ship with Steamworks. I suspect it will be option 2 where Crate sell via Steam, amongst any number of other distributors. And the game will be a simple exe file that does not seek out Steam and need it to load.

                  Finally, as if I'm not done yet. There are a number of games that also exist where a person can buy without going through the Steam store and add to their account. Two examples again off the top of my head were Frozen Synapse (I bought into the beta and claimed a key on steam later) as well as Hegemony Gold, which I bought direct from Longbow, and then later claimed the key on Steam. It is early stages yet, and I think Crate have said nothing as to whether they will be able to do such a method (at the mercy of Valve) but such an option also exists. And even with a game like Frozen Synapse or Hegemony Gold, I can indeed play those games without Steam. I can in fact download the game direct from the dev's and run it. Steam just makes it more convenient.

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                  • @Skellt

                    It happened several times that I wanted to start Steam offline and it didn't want to start like that because it wanted to go online to update stuff, only that I had no connection at that time. So basically I had no offline working. I had to wait few days to come back where there was connection, start for a couple of seconds online and then I could use offline... but it was too late, Steam took the shame. I will give it a second chance after I try again to forbid any kind of automatic updates, but I wouldn't bet my life this will not happen again.

                    As for the second point, I always prefer not having to take back what is mine... today's rights aren't what they used to be... but people seem to be ok with that. I guess old people die for a reason... or go to GOG...

                    @ Josho: "I suspect it will be option 2 where Crate sell via Steam, amongst any number of other distributors. And the game will be a simple exe file that does not seek out Steam and need it to load."

                    Hey, thanks for coming up with this! I light of your technical clarification, Skellt is correct in his previous comparison between Steam and Crate versions.
                    Last edited by nbringer; 05-08-2012, 12:28 PM.

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                    • Achievements...bleh
                      They ruin games for me. I have this monster inside that forces me to get them all, even though it's boring as nothing else!

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by nbringer View Post
                        @Skellt

                        It happened several times that I wanted to start Steam offline and it didn't want to start like that because it wanted to go online to update stuff, only that I had no connection at that time. So basically I had no offline working. I had to wait few days to come back where there was connection, start for a couple of seconds online and then I could use offline... but it was too late, Steam took the shame. I will give it a second chance after I try again to forbid any kind of automatic updates, but I wouldn't bet my life this will not happen again.
                        Regarding this. You are correct in that Steam would not start correctly when without internet. It used to be that to go into offline mode, one had to be online and tell steam to restart via offline mode (see edit). I've been caught out myself before... However, I am speaking in past tense in my last sentence. Having just tried it now by pulling the network cable out from my PC (with steam not active in the background, the process shut down) I was in fact able to start steam in offline mode. It comes up with a box where the option to start in offline mode is made available.

                        Secondly, the auto update is a little wonky when I've used it. Sometimes the games just ignore it and will continue to update anyway. Team Fortress 2 has been a prime candidate, though I suspect it might be due to updates to the source engine perhaps. It is easy enough to fix however, simply pause the download and it remains paused, no matter how many times you log in and out of steam. It just sits there ready to re-download when you require.

                        Of course, part of the trouble with the updates via Steam is that it looks for variations in the files. So even if a few lines of code were added or altered in a multi-gigabyte file, it will have to redownload the full file. It is one of those annoying features. Imagine my annoyance when, with my piddly 10GB per month download limit, I was trying to play Section 8: Prejudice. I manage to successfully get it downloaded. Then next day it ends up needing another multi-gigabyte download. I had to wait until the end of the next month to get the update. Frustrating as anything.

                        For what its worth, I don't see Steam as some sort of savior of gaming. In fact, I grow very concerned about their market share. But it isn't some sort of evil application that burns puppies, pillages villages and rejects good games (while letting questionable shit get through). Actually, it does the latter, but that is for another time.

                        *Edit: Just to add regarding steam offline mode. Once in offline mode, a person could then remain in offline mode until they chose to go online. When I knew I'd be without internet, I'd have to keep in mind that I needed to restart in offline. That would be all I had to do for the few weeks without internet I'd endure. However, this is no longer necessary.
                        Last edited by Josho; 05-08-2012, 01:29 PM.

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                        • Originally posted by nbringer View Post
                          @Skellt

                          It happened several times that I wanted to start Steam offline and it didn't want to start like that because it wanted to go online to update stuff, only that I had no connection at that time. So basically I had no offline working. I had to wait few days to come back where there was connection, start for a couple of seconds online and then I could use offline... but it was too late, Steam took the shame. I will give it a second chance after I try again to forbid any kind of automatic updates, but I wouldn't bet my life this will not happen again.

                          As for the second point, I always prefer not having to take back what is mine... today's rights aren't what they used to be... but people seem to be ok with that. I guess old people die for a reason... or go to GOG...
                          hah thats why :P i didnt mean Offline mode, i meant offline, as in go in the folder and open the shortcut yourself, just as you would with any other game, you don't need to go through steam with 95% of the games that way

                          Its in your steam folder, i can give you path tonight..

                          Thats why i wanted to clear up things

                          Originally posted by Josho View Post
                          *Edit: Just to add regarding steam offline mode. Once in offline mode, a person could then remain in offline mode until they chose to go online. When I knew I'd be without internet, I'd have to keep in mind that I needed to restart in offline. That would be all I had to do for the few weeks without internet I'd endure. However, this is no longer necessary.
                          And as stated above, you dont even need to be in offline mode :P

                          And all i'm saying is, Steam is nearly the only way to get PC games here in QC.. so i can only assume that it is coming for you guys as well,

                          And the market share depends really on what games you have

                          For instance, Grim Dawn, 30% is alot yes, but its also insane exposure.

                          But to Lets say Arkham City, Skyrim and whatnot, its just taking their profit since everyone would buy regardless.

                          And as merdierra stated. Steam is often not as worse as retailers.

                          So digital distribution is the future imo, and we'll eventually move to that, with a few rare cases of hey here is a boxed collector edition kind of thing.
                          So instead of downloading in 70 different places, i myself prefer to download directly from steam
                          Last edited by Skellt; 05-08-2012, 04:37 PM.
                          Currently playing : The Pit : Sword of the stars / Dota 2 / Don't Starve / Age of Empires 2 : Forgotten Empires / Dishonored / Antichamber

                          Steam Username : Skellt

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                          • Love being able to join my friends games from within steam. Makes gaming with others that much easier.

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                            • There should be diversity and choice. There should be a version of the steam and not steam.
                              I am personally not too keen on steam and I prefer playing on the DVD.

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                              • Originally posted by Skellt View Post
                                And as stated above, you dont even need to be in offline mode :P
                                I know... However 95% is quite generous. Some games will launch without looking for steam, most games (or the majority I tried) will insist on Steam launching in, as a bare minimum, in offline mode which is all I had available. I think it depends on how what the executable file calls upon before it will load.

                                I just tried by disconnecting my ethernet cable and launching a myriad of exe files associated with a number of my games on steam. So for a purist that were to buy a game from Steam, then uninstall Steam to remove DRM from their system, I think it is pot luck as to whether they can launch without steam. Of course, if someone went to that sort of extreme, then what is the point of obtaining a game by that method

                                I think you and I are saying the same thing, just in different ways. For what its worth, I haven't bought a game from a physical store in a long time now

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