What are all these boxes for?!

[medierra]

Here is a little mystery to keep you pondering... Along with a much expanded inventory, you'll notice 4 additional equipment slots... because I'm evil I didn't include the item silhouettes that indicate what goes where! hah.. haha... hahaHaHaha. MUAHaHaahAHaHAHAHA

http://www.grimdawn.com/screenshots/2010mar18_charscreen.jpg

P.S. the top left-most small 32x32 box is where the weapon swap button will go. It will probably end up having a different shape so it doesn't look like a slot. Bottom left slot is for the auto-sort button.

Also, this is pure designer art atm. Later on in the project an artist will touch this up and make it look pretty.

[Void(null)]

Top Left = Equipped Items
Bottom Left = Inventory
Top Right = Quest Journal
Bottom Right = Porn Collection

[Void(null)]

Edit: Ignore me, really. I was being an idjit.

[ASYLUM101]

OH MAN!

That is sexy!
I'm not gonna bother figuring it out, that is too awesome!

[medierra]

To that note, what you have looks clean and great. But it looks like a default ARPG UI, with no real character. While I can't see it detracting at all, it also doesn't seem to add very much in the way of atmosphere. It looks functional, not "OMG that looks awesome!"


Yeah, well, it's stand-in designer-art for the purpose of laying out the UI, so don't expect too much. Artists will add all the interesting bits later once it is finalized. I doubt it will be Fallout3 level of awesome simply because we don't have a dedicated UI artist but the end product will most likely have a lot more character.

[Void(null)]

Edit 2: Seriously, there was nothing of any real content in this post other than someone remembering "The good old days" better than they were.

[The Old Farmer]

What is tentatively planed for the two large right side boxes? The one below the P and the one to the right of the inventory squares ( this one I suspect is for expanding inventory another 6-7 rows).
Will the paper doll be rotatable so we can check out how our loot looks on the character?

[medierra]

What is tentatively planed for the two large right side boxes? The one below the P and the one to the right of the inventory squares.

It wouldn't be very evil if I just told you right away now would it?

Will the paper doll be rotatable so we can check out how our loot looks on the character?

Yeah, the representation of the character will by 3d / rotatable and work exactly the same.

[The Old Farmer]

It wouldn't be very evil if I just told you right away now would it?

.

Such a tease.

Its good to see you still have a sense of humor in this line of work.

[Kluga]

Man, looks pretty sweet! My brain is gonna explode with excitement. Top work :D

[cel]

Hmmm... 2x earrings (or trinkets, whichever you prefer to call them, extra accessories anyway) and a belt? The last one is most likely pants while leg protectors have turned into boots. Nice :)

About DarN's UI's: Altough the pics are indeed pretty, I don't get a "wow!" effect from any of them (I do get that from the GD pic though, even if it has a sort of a standard'ish feeling; most likely due to the griddyness of the equip slot placement) and they seem a little "out-of-place", not fitting in with the original art.

Considering that even as it is now, the GD window looks very good, I doubt that anyone except the person who is familiar with the style of art used here would be able to prettify it further without making it look like the rest of the art were just cut&pasted into place.

PS. Is she (http://www.grimdawn.com/webfiles/graphics_slaying.gif) holding a gun or is it just me? Has there been any word on guns?

[Void(null)]

About DarN's UI's: Altough the pics are indeed pretty, I don't get a "wow!" effect from any of them (I do get that from the GD pic though, even if it has a sort of a standard'ish feeling; most likely due to the griddyness of the equip slot placement) and they seem a little "out-of-place", not fitting in with the original art.

Edit: You are absolutely right.

Given the opportunity to work on Grim Dawn, I am sure a dedicated artist could do some amazing victoriana that would fit the setting. Victoriana really is an artists dream, all the guilding, the wonderful use of raw materials, the leather and lace, the copper. It's intricate and decorational, yet solid and functional.

I can see the inventory being composed of a rotting leather bound book that looks as if it was dragged out of a lovecraft novel, the world map looking like the chart right out of the conquests of the British empire, the compass a flip top railmans pocket watch... all of that sort of thing.

[VeggieBoy]

Top Left = Equipped Items
Bottom Left = Inventory
Top Right = Quest Journal
Bottom Right = Porn Collection

I have no meaningful message to post except to congratulate you on the sheer funniness of that. :D

[medierra]

Hmmm... 2x earrings (or trinkets, whichever you prefer to call them, extra accessories anyway) and a belt? The last one is most likely pants while leg protectors have turned into boots. Nice :)

No earrings, although one 32x32 slot is something you might consider a trinket but one for which we're planning to have in-game models attach to the PC. The item-type we're replacing artifacts with is now a 32x32 slot too.


About DarN's UI's: Altough the pics are indeed pretty, I don't get a "wow!" effect from any of them (I do get that from the GD pic though, even if it has a sort of a standard'ish feeling; most likely due to the griddyness of the equip slot placement) and they seem a little "out-of-place", not fitting in with the original art.

In all honesty, I apologize but I looked at some screenshots of DarN's UI and without a side-by-side I'm afraid I can't tell the difference. Are they just cleaned up / up-res'ed or is there actually new art?


PS. Is she (http://www.grimdawn.com/webfiles/graphics_slaying.gif) holding a gun or is it just me? Has there been any word on guns?

Yeah, there will be guns. We'll be taking some liberties with them though, so it won't all be exactly standard victorian-era fare. However, we're not going in a science-fictiony direction... no energy guns or anything like that.

[alexei]

2 weapon/shield slot
1 headgear slot
1 body armor slot
1 boot slot
1 glove slot
1 shoulder pad slot
1 artifact slot
1 belt slot
1 amulet/trinket
2 rings
2 more small slot? Potion slot?

Top right box - Character information
Down right box - Extended inventory? Or new surprise?

[alexei]

Huh artifact is 32x32 slot? Then those two are artifact slot maybe? And then we have another guess for square slot, what's that could be?

[Betrayer]

That must be where the squares go!

[medierra]

2 weapon/shield slot
1 headgear slot
1 body armor slot
1 boot slot
1 glove slot
1 shoulder pad slot
1 artifact slot
1 belt slot
1 amulet/trinket
2 rings
2 more small slot? Potion slot?

Top right box - Character information
Down right box - Extended inventory? Or new surprise?

Just about got it - final 32x32 slot is for "medals" or various other ornaments that you can pin to your chest. We're hoping to be able to attach an in-game model to the chest armor for this. Right now we're working on a new system for armor where it swaps out that entire region of the body so you aren't wearing armor over a naked dude. This will eliminate issues where armor clips the player's body and will give us a lot more flexibility in terms of the look of the armor.

[Scryer]

For the tetris inventory it would be nice if you had gear take up the least possible number of spaces, like 1x1 and a 2x1, going into anything with 4 slots and above seems like it'll take up too much space.

That's 84 spaces to fill up, but having items like 3x3 shields or plate is pretty large, lets see, if I break it down by the total number of objects a player can carry vs max slots taken up.

Each one takes up -

1x1 = 84 total slots.

2x1 = 42 total slots.

3x1 = 28 total slots.

2x2 = 21 total slots.

3x2 = 14 total slots.

3x3 = 9 total slots


I think? Unless I got my math wrong. Either way, the more objects I'm allowed the carry the happier I'll be.

I wonder what the biggest size you guys have in mind is, also I do like tetris inventory, but I don't like bulky items that take up too much space.

It's one of the things I hated about Diablo 2's tetris system, too many bulky items, standardizing it would have been much better in my opinion.

Looks like a pretty good mockup though.

[Llama8]

Right now we're working on a new system for armor where it swaps out that entire region of the body so you aren't wearing armor over a naked dude. This will eliminate issues where armor clips the player's body and will give us a lot more flexibility in terms of the look of the armor.
That would be really cool, while clipping isn't a particularly big issue (during combat at least), it would look a lot nicer when you're shopping/standing around.

energy runs
Is that a sci-fi equivalent of Bengal Belly/eating too much too hot curry/etc? Or a new, er, rear-facing AoE attack?

As far as the pic is concerned, it looks like a fairly standard/functional inventory UI (even if it is just something you knocked up with some crayons). As long as the UI doesn't get in the way of playing, like S2's does with the stash/combo master (please let us have a fast way of moving stuff between inventory & stash, like shift-clicking or something, rather than having to pick up & move each item individually) I'll be happy.

[Chameleon]

I dont mind the tetris system so long as each item takes up only one slot. ;)

[andreyy]

In all honesty, I apologize but I looked at some screenshots of DarN's UI and without a side-by-side I'm afraid I can't tell the difference. Are they just cleaned up / up-res'ed or is there actually new art?

Because DarN's UI isn't really that awesome, art-wise. It's functional. The problem in F3 was that the lists were too small, the text, sometimes, too big, while there was a lot of space to expand. You were forced to scroll and scroll and scroll - during dialogs, equiping and using items, choosing perks, etc.

Pretty much the same with Oblivion. It's there that you can say he actually made some art. But is it better, prettier? I'm not sure.

[medierra]

Is that a sci-fi equivalent of Bengal Belly/eating too much too hot curry/etc? Or a new, er, rear-facing AoE attack?


Haha, wow, I couldn't have set myself up any better!

[Llama8]

I think that one of the masteries/classes/whatever should be curry-based. There's so much you can do with it (fire damage, poison damage, blind, stun, debuff, it's all there). Hell, you could even have a skill that you cast on your pets (desicated coconut) to make them into walking bombs.

[Roros]

I have no objection against inventory tetris as long as it's mindfully made. I quite enjoyed the inventory management in resident evil 4 and deus ex, but I have a hard time answering whether I liked it in diablo2 and TQ.

I also have no objection to 1x1 items across the board. I don't think I've ever played a game without inv. tetris and found myself thinking "man, inventory management is really dumbed down, this sucks!".

[Void(null)]

In all honesty, I apologize but I looked at some screenshots of DarN's UI and without a side-by-side I'm afraid I can't tell the difference. Are they just cleaned up / up-res'ed or is there actually new art?


Let me reinstall Oblivion and Pull up some side by side comparison pics.

Edit: You're absolutely right!

In 90% of cases its just a change to font, spacing, positioning, cleaning up the original images and upping the resolution. The effect is impressive and it makes a world of difference, but it uses damn near all of the original artwork as source.

I guess this is what happens when you don't play a game for few years, your memory of what was and was not awesome becomes a little hazy.

I withdraw everything I have said about UI's, chalk it up to someone remembering "The good old days" far too fondly.

My sincerest apologies, but hey... at least I was willing to go off and do the legwork for comparison pics instead of wasting someone else time. I still have them, but seeing as how this was a discussion about original artwork, and not font/layout it seems a little moot to post them.

This does give me a new appreciation for the artwork in Oblivion.

Egg on my face I tell you.

:)

[Azrael]

(please let us have a fast way of moving stuff between inventory & stash, like shift-clicking or something, rather than having to pick up & move each item individually) I'll be happy.

Regarding this, medierra, do you have any plans of implementing a sort of drag-box selection (like I suggested here http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showthread.php?t=224)?

Just wondering.

EDIT: I've never seen another game do it, and I think it's a simple but effective way to move large amounts of items from stash to inventory or vice versa :)

[medierra]

Listening to some of the constructive feedback on the forum and nonsensical whining from Rhis, I decided to reduce the size of the chest armor and boots. Boots were just 2x3 so both sides would be somewhat symmetrical, so no real loss there. The torso armor I think will suffer a bit visually as the long overcoat pieces might end up looking kind of small. However, I think it is for the greater good and satisfies the original goal I had of normalizing equipment sizes so there were more ways to fit stuff together.

Here is rev2 of the char screen with a little aesthetic enhancement as well (or dehancement if you don't like it).

http://www.grimdawn.com/screenshots/2010mar19_charscreen.jpg

While it may look somewhat generic, or, I prefer the term, utilitarian ;) I think one reason for that is that it is currently empty. It feels much more Grim-Dawnesque in-game with the character model in the center and will with items. Since we're packing in 4 extra item slots and a lot of additional inventory space into the same size UI screen as TQ, there just isn't that much room for decorative art.

[Void(null)]

You added depth and shadow, the rust and blood splatter, the extra beading to give all the lines a more 3d effect.

It looks really good, the whole thing now "pops" a lot more. I will say The blood is a little shiny, it drawn the eye to the center.

http://i39.tinypic.com/izrij4.jpg

Were it not for the bloods lighter colored splatter, or were the blood cut back a little near the center point, then the decay would be more uniform and the eye would follow a more even line.

As an example:

http://i41.tinypic.com/33atobl.jpg

Now the eye follows evenly down the image because its not weighted towards the middle cross so much.

Also, thank you for letting is see the creative process. Its really neat to see how you guys are evolving your ideas. The added detail to take two of the UI's really does add an amazing amount of character.

Edit: Fixed the garish white background for the text to be more forum friendly

[Llama8]

The only difference I can tell is that the dividing line between the inventory & the rag doll bit has shifted up a bit so that the two boxes are now below the line rather than above it.

[Void(null)]

Easier to see the difference side by side.

http://www.grimdawn.com/screenshots/2010mar18_charscreen.jpg http://www.grimdawn.com/screenshots/2010mar19_charscreen.jpg

The bevil is given two beads instead of one, each of the connection points has been made more ornate. Shadow has been added. Rust and Blood Splatter has been added. X has been made more or an orange red rather than a dark red.

As a result the whole thing "pops" more. Its really a marked difference.

[Rhis]

This is like a spot the difference puzzle!

[The Old Farmer]

Looking good, will you be making a thinner border around the inventory area?
Also seems you need to rinse off your work area more often as some of the blood is getting on your templates.

[medierra]

Well, maybe certain people's eyes will flow to the X and then they'll get back to playing faster instead of sitting around town forever looking at their loot in multiplayer games (subshape). :p

[Void(null)]

Well, maybe certain people's eyes will flow to the X and then they'll get back to playing faster instead of sitting around town forever looking at their loot in multiplayer games (subshape). :p

Hahah, Im guilty of that myself.

"No, give me just a few more minutes, Im trying to see if this sword is better than the one I have now, you go Ill catch up."

Its looking really nice btw.

[JMD]

Thumbs up, guys! Looking very nice indeed. :cool:

[ASYLUM101]

Well, maybe certain people's eyes will flow to the X and then they'll get back to playing faster instead of sitting around town forever looking at their loot in multiplayer games (subshape). :p

LOL. I soooo know the feeling of waiting around for loot-watchers and gold-collectors... soooo annoying lol

[Panthro]

I just want it confirmed that there will be a "pocketwatch" slot...

I think you'd want a nice half-huntsman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pocketwatch#Hunter-case_watches) for monster slaying.

[Scryer]

Nice update, thanks! I'm not sure what to change, if I can think of anything I'll mention it. Standardization of the tetris style inventory, for all items, is all I can think of so far.

[Malpheas]

I just gotta say: HOORAY FOR BELTS!

[Scryer]

I just want it confirmed that there will be a "pocketwatch" slot...

I think you'd want a nice half-huntsman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pocketwatch#Hunter-case_watches) for monster slaying.

Pocketwatch instead of Trinket sounds good to me. Or you could have a type of trinket that is a pocketwatch.

[medierra]

Nice update, thanks! I'm not sure what to change, if I can think of anything I'll mention it. Standardization of the tetris style inventory, for all items, is all I can think of so far.

I think we're pretty committed to the variable item size at this point. This was a decision we carefully deliberated over and, ultimately, it was the TQ audience that set us down our current path. Fans on titanquest.net voted 98 to 18 in favor of variable item sizes and so here we are. :D

http://www.titanquest.net/forums/grim-dawn-suggestions/31418-single-item-size-not.html

I believe it was the right choice though. In my opinion you lose a little of the magic of item collection when you go to a single-size system. I think this system will be a good compromise for everyone. It has variable size but the sizes are much more uniform than those of TQ and with the taller inventory grid, there are more possible ways to fit different sized items together in the same column.

[Scryer]

I think we're pretty committed to the variable item size at this point. This was a decision we carefully deliberated over and, ultimately, it was the TQ audience that set us down our current path. Fans on titanquest.net voted 98 to 18 in favor of variable item sizes and so here we are. :D

http://www.titanquest.net/forums/grim-dawn-suggestions/31418-single-item-size-not.html

Yeah, I don't mind variables, I'm not a big fan of the 1 slot per item for ARPG's, but I do like the idea of making items have smaller sizes. In Diablo 2 I couldn't stand some of the big bulky items that existed. If I could make a suggestion -

1x1 for small items.

2x1 for short sword / daggers.

3x1 for longer weapons.

2x2 for all shields.

3x2 for chest armor.

2x2 for boots.

1x2 for belts.

2x2 for helms.

3x1 for ranged weapons.

etc.

I mean, items that are above 4x3 and so on are just sooo big, and having to go back to town to put them away is such a pain.

I like variables again, I just wish they were more standardized.

Cool, you must of edited that right as I was typing lol. Good to know you'll standardize the tetris style. ^_^

[medierra]

Ah, I get what you're saying now.

Yeah the item sizes are pretty close to what you describe. The largest possible item we can fit into the current weapon slots is 4x2 but I don't know that we'll actually have anything over 3 units tall. We currently don't have any polearms or staves planned. The overcoats were going to be 4x2 but we've scaled back to 3x2 based on people's suggestions, which we thought made good sense and also helped us to layout the UI a little better.

So currently the max size for each slot is:

Head - 2x2

Chest - 2x3

Shoulders - 2x2

Hands - 2x2

Waist - 2x1

Legs - 2x3

Feet - 2x2

Weapons - 2x4 (although largest planned weapons are 2x3)

Rings, Necklace, Medals, Talismans - 1x1

You'll also be pleased to know that you can stack 99 potions. :)

[Void(null)]

One thing I have never understood.

Why is Chest Armor always 2x3 yet boots and helm are 2x2. Those must be some epic sized boots if they are the same size as a round shield. Dude must have MASSIVE sized feet, and you know what they say about guys with big feet?

They have big... inventory's to carry them.

I know its an ARPG standard, but it still makes absolutely no sense in anything other than inventory mathematics that somehow bend the laws of space.

Just think about it logically for a moment.

A ring, that covers a part of your finger is a 1x1 unit.

That means that by the spacial laws of inventory mathematics, a belt is the width of two fingers and a pair of boots is the size of two stacks of two rings, and peoples Torso's are the size of two stacks of three rings, and people are running around with Longswords that are less that an inch tall.

Or going in the inverse direction.

A Ring would be the size of 1/6th of your torso. So lets say that an average sized man is 6 foot and weighs 170lbs. Your torso is 50% of your mass, so thats about 3 feet and 85lbs, so a ring would be 6 inches and weigh 14.16lbs. Thats a huge ring.

Yet we all gladly accept these amazingly odd physics and proportions as a given, because its what we are accustomed to and it makes sense from a game balance perspective when size and space are used as a balance point as opposed to weight.

Why yes, I have been drinking, why do you ask?

[Renevent]

Rings, Necklace, Medals, Talismans

New item types?

[alexei]

It's look better than the first draft which is a bit skinny and clean, but it's look likes it was awfully embossed. Border take up inventory spaces and other boxes. The X button look likes it's push down. Well, I think it is quick touch up from previous draft so I don't mind much.

Still, I like the bold border. It feel much more metal.

[medierra]

Yet we all gladly accept these amazingly odd physics and proportions as a given, because its what we are accustomed to and it makes sense from a game balance perspective when size and space are used as a balance point as opposed to weight.


Variable item size serves absolutely no balancing purpose to me. It would really probably make more sense in terms of balance to have a 1-size system where you could more perfectly regulate the max number of items the player could carry. I mean, the value of an item is not tied to it's size or weight. An inventory full of rings would probably have the most value per grid space.

Rather, it is all about the player being able to see images of the equipment that can allow them to feel as though they are dealing with real objects that they can see. The approximation obviously can't be perfect and size is totally out of proportion but the human mind is good as suspending disbelief and immersing itself into virtual realities. The important thing here is just that players get to see imagines large enough to effectively convey the look of the gear and that there is some sense of scale, even if skewed and compromised by the limitations of the UI space.

I enjoyed your drunk dissertation though. :p

It's funny because Rhis was complaining last night about how the boots were too large compared to the overcoat and the overcoat was too big compared to the pants. I was like "uhh, if you're worried about that, then you better not look at the rings". ;)

The two most important and competing factors here are really item sizes large enough that we can create satisfying visuals for each piece of equipment and item sizes small enough that inventory management isn't ridiculous.

[medierra]

Why yes, I have been drinking, why do you ask?

Although, apparently not enough if you can still type that well... :p

[SoulSeekkor]

Love the look so far! And love that you guys keep us in the loop like this, pretty cool to see how something even as simple as the inventory UI changes over time and takes in input from the game's consumer base...

Good work! :)

Soul

[ASYLUM101]

We currently don't have any polearms or staves planned.


NOOOOOOO!

Damn, I love my polearms. That's what I missed about TQ, there was no huge two-handed poleaxes... Oh well...

[myrmidon]

danget why 99? i always take 100 potions with me now im gonna die of a shortage!

[Starkrun]

NOOOOOOO!

Damn, I love my polearms. That's what I missed about TQ, there was no huge two-handed poleaxes... Oh well...

No Big's they said no 2handers as launch but there's a good possibility it'll make it into the expansion. And this INV looks amazing, Love the cold steel feel of it.

And did I hear someone mention they are going to use a full Mesh replacement for Armor? That would make crafting items a lot easier since you could just edit existing meshes/textures.

[Void(null)]

Although, apparently not enough if you can still type that well... :p

I shall take that as a form of challenge and drink more!

I am actually a fan of inventory Tetris, But it was simply one of those moment of "You know when you think about it for a second, this makes absolutely no sense."

It is far easier for me to suspend my disbelief about the odd proportions than it is to accept every item takes the exact same inventory slot yet has a different mass. I have fond memory's of rearranging my inventory in Diablo, Neverwinter Nights and Titan Quest, trying to get everything to fit together in the best possible way and still be organized.

It makes me sad to think that we are moving away from that to a 1 item = 1 unit system, where everything is the same size, or there simply is no inventory representation at all, AKA Oblivion and Mass Effect.

I find it interesting that you guys have chosen to add a leg section, I cant think of many games that use that mechanic, normally legs are covered by Torso or Feet, but having a section for legs should at the very least, stretch out the proportion of the body so that it will be 11 units tall rather than the traditional 8.

Head 2
Torso 3
Belt 1
Legs 3
Feet 2

VS

Head 2
Torso 3
Belt 1
Feet 2

it should certainly add more to the visual representation.

[Scryer]

Ah, I get what you're saying now.

Yeah the item sizes are pretty close to what you describe. The largest possible item we can fit into the current weapon slots is 4x2 but I don't know that we'll actually have anything over 3 units tall. We currently don't have any polearms or staves planned. The overcoats were going to be 4x2 but we've scaled back to 3x2 based on people's suggestions, which we thought made good sense and also helped us to layout the UI a little better.

So currently the max size for each slot is:

Head - 2x2

Chest - 2x3

Shoulders - 2x2

Hands - 2x2

Waist - 2x1

Legs - 2x3

Feet - 2x2

Weapons - 2x4 (although largest planned weapons are 2x3)

Rings, Necklace, Medals, Talismans - 1x1

You'll also be pleased to know that you can stack 99 potions. :)

Thanks for the reply! Yeah, basically all I was getting at was that I would like to see much smaller gear sizes, I think they went a little overboard in D2.

Yep, the smaller and more standard you can make your gear the better in my opinion. Giving us more room to hoard our catch of the day without having to flank our way back to town is always a good idea.

99 potions eh? hahaha, ahhhh... so do you have multiple types of health potions are are you going to have just 1 type and make it scale, like have it heal 60% HP with a cooldown?

It's good to see you guys making a better inventory for us, from the item types you've mentioned it sounds functional and much more fun. You can fit 14 types of 2x3 items in there, which is a lot! So, anything you can do to reduce the sizes and make them standard, I think we could all appreciate that. ^_^

[MadWasp]

Listening to some of the constructive feedback on the forum and nonsensical whining from Rhis, I decided to reduce the size of the chest armor and boots. Boots were just 2x3 so both sides would be somewhat symmetrical, so no real loss there. The torso armor I think will suffer a bit visually as the long overcoat pieces might end up looking kind of small. However, I think it is for the greater good and satisfies the original goal I had of normalizing equipment sizes so there were more ways to fit stuff together.

Here is rev2 of the char screen with a little aesthetic enhancement as well (or dehancement if you don't like it).

http://www.grimdawn.com/screenshots/2010mar19_charscreen.jpg

While it may look somewhat generic, or, I prefer the term, utilitarian ;) I think one reason for that is that it is currently empty. It feels much more Grim-Dawnesque in-game with the character model in the center and will with items. Since we're packing in 4 extra item slots and a lot of additional inventory space into the same size UI screen as TQ, there just isn't that much room for decorative art.


Rev2 Inventory is good. Keep way of art. Steel, rust and corrosion looks cool. Keep us inform.
"Necromancer's choice" Some Victorian style decorative art would be also good on outside of util border.

[Llama8]

Pocketwatch instead of Trinket sounds good to me. Or you could have a type of trinket that is a pocketwatch.

A fob watch would be cool, possibly as a name for an item that goes in the medal slot?

[Scryer]

A fob watch would be cool, possibly as a name for an item that goes in the medal slot?

I think they need to change the name from "Talisman" to Pocket Watch! Lol. Naw, yeah, a pocket watch item class within the existing classes, like a pocket watch sub-class.

[eisprinzessin]

I like, that you moved the buttons to the bags and separated them from the equipment section (http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showthread.php?t=461&page=4), which looks a bit cluttered in rev1.

I'm amazed by all the posts in no time, and how important the character screen is to everyone. :)

[Void(null)]

I like, that you moved the buttons to the bags and separated them from the equipment section (http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showthread.php?t=461&page=4), which looks a bit cluttered in rev1.

I'm amazed by all the posts in no time, and how important the character screen is to everyone. :)

Well think about it for a moment.

In an ARPG over the course of years, how much of peoples playtime do you think is spent looking at that screen? Between looting and juggling stats, How many hours, days weeks are subconsciously burnt into our minds?

So it needs to be functional so we don't spend more time in it than we need to be, but it also needs to be aesthetically pleasing in a way that we are not going to mind or even notice that we spend so much time looking at that screen, and because the looting/item bonus part of an ARPG is such an important part of character progress, we ARP fans have a greater appreciation for the inventory/character screen than most.

[MadWasp]

Well think about it for a moment.

In an ARPG over the course of years, how much of peoples playtime do you think is spent looking at that screen? Between looting and juggling stats, How many hours, days weeks are subconsciously burnt into our minds?

So it needs to be functional so we don't spend more time in it than we need to be, but it also needs to be aesthetically pleasing in a way that we are not going to mind or even notice that we spend so much time looking at that screen, and because the looting/item bonus part of an ARPG is such an important part of character progress, we ARP fans have a greater appreciation for the inventory/character screen than most.

Exactly!!!!!

[The Old Farmer]

because the looting/item bonus part of an ARPG is such an important part of character progress, we ARP fans have a greater appreciation for the inventory/character screen than most.

On that thought lets hope that there is a good way to compare items that we have on and what we pickup. If its weapons then meaningfull damage comparisons and if its protections the likewise easily understandable ways to show how X is Better than Y.

[Starkrun]

On the side by side, I don't like the edge embossed look at all. It feels over the top and IMO un-needed. The edge that exists is fine enough.

The Distressed metal look is nice but we know so very little about the game's over all art direction its not fair to assume a rusted metal would fit well with all the classes and feel, maybe weld lines would work better. The UI is the common thematic element that you will see from the start to the end of the game and it needs to always fit in no matter whats happening.

Thats why I feel a Dynamic UI that changes from start to finish would be nice, as a base indicator or either progression in the game or class. Like the longer you go the more rust and oxidation that appears.

[alexei]

I heard from other thread that there will be lot of grenado and sachel charge, so is that item have their own slot or it's gonna be like potion (put in inventory)? Or skill maybe?

[heron]

The ui layout reminds me of TQ, loving it!

[Llama8]

I heard from other thread that there will be lot of grenado and sachel charge, so is that item have their own slot or it's gonna be like potion (put in inventory)? Or skill maybe?

Given that Medierra was talking about a particular class (demolition class), they're probably skills. Though you could also make them weapons.

[Prosoro]

All I can say is its looking really good and I love what I see as does everyone else! Even in the design stages! Tis' sad about the staves but am hopeful for expansions and you said 'We currently' as not to say your've completely ruled them out right..? :D Thanks for the update and Im always impressed with how interactive you guys at Crate are with the community and with concidering our suggestions/feedback etc, its awesome!

Can't wait to fill that inventory with all kindza shiny loot! ^^,

[Void]

One thing I have never understood.

Why is Chest Armor always 2x3 yet boots and helm are 2x2. Those must be some epic sized boots if they are the same size as a round shield. Dude must have MASSIVE sized feet, and you know what they say about guys with big feet?

They have big... inventory's to carry them.

I know its an ARPG standard, but it still makes absolutely no sense in anything other than inventory mathematics that somehow bend the laws of space.

Just think about it logically for a moment.

A ring, that covers a part of your finger is a 1x1 unit.

That means that by the spacial laws of inventory mathematics, a belt is the width of two fingers and a pair of boots is the size of two stacks of two rings, and peoples Torso's are the size of two stacks of three rings, and people are running around with Longswords that are less that an inch tall.

Or going in the inverse direction.

A Ring would be the size of 1/6th of your torso. So lets say that an average sized man is 6 foot and weighs 170lbs. Your torso is 50% of your mass, so thats about 3 feet and 85lbs, so a ring would be 6 inches and weigh 14.16lbs. Thats a huge ring.

Yet we all gladly accept these amazingly odd physics and proportions as a given, because its what we are accustomed to and it makes sense from a game balance perspective when size and space are used as a balance point as opposed to weight.

Why yes, I have been drinking, why do you ask?

I concur...

[Void(null)]

This is odd... it feels like I am agreeing with part of myself or something.

Void is giving me an identity crisis!

If we get a user named "null" I am screwed.

[xSmokin]

This is odd... it feels like I am agreeing with part of myself or something.

Void is giving me an identity crisis!

If we get a user named "null" I am screwed.

multiple personalities need avenues in forums too I'm sure :D

[chris01]

Top=Helmet placement
The 4 mini boxes=Amulets

The rest.....I will just leave it :P

[Code187]

how about a new picture of the inventory in progress ???

so we can see the small changes you do the look, if i dont remember wrong then a screenshot of an inventory with it final look will never hurt the game or ruin the expatasions :-P

yet again sry my spellings

[MadWasp]

how about a new picture of the inventory in progress ???

so we can see the small changes you do the look, if i dont remember wrong then a screenshot of an inventory with it final look will never hurt the game or ruin the expatasions :-P

yet again sry my spellings
+1...............

[chris01]

+1...............

second that.........

[medierra]

Ok, here is the latest on the character screen. We actually didn't do much with it since the last post but then recently we made the decision to increase the size of the UI windows so that at 1024x768 they will be flush with the top of the screen and the top of the HUD toolbar. The primary reason for this is that we wanted to expand the size of the quest UI, which will somewhat differently than TQ... always hated the TQ quest UI...

Anyway, the good news for the character screen is that it now has 288 inventory grid units including the 3 add-on bags (and we might try to squeeze in a 4th) as compared to TQ's 180. Zomg!

http://www.grimdawn.com/screenshots/blog2010-06-01_charscreenwip.jpg

(note that various buttons don't show up since they are separate graphics and not part of the UI background image - which is what this is)

[deimos]

Damn, i so want to get on with filling all those squares!

+1 for the 4th bag and quest interface change.

[MadWasp]

Okay, super! thx 4 sneak peak inventory!


It's high time to look at some action with it! :)

[Code187]

yes THX alot for feeding us dogs he he he


+1 for the 4th bag

[Kardiophylax]

Yay for the next evolution in Grim Dawn outerwear, the Backpack of Holding*. Now I can keep everything AND the kitchen sink inside it.


* Not to be confused with the "Bag of Holding"

[MageMaster]

Having an Autosort is handy. I really liked the bags from TQ because of using them to sort for certain types of items.


Oops:Meant to quote a previous post..

Love the inventory screen..

Also someone mentioned about hours/too much time burned into our brains...
It get pretty bad sometimes... you goto bed, close your eyes and all you see is the game screen....
Gets to be almost deja vu at times. LOL

[Chameleon]

Anyway, the good news for the character screen is that it now has 288 inventory grid units including the 3 add-on bags (and we might try to squeeze in a 4th) as compared to TQ's 180. Zomg!


So that means I will fill up my inventory half an hour through normal instead of ten minutes into the game as in TQ. :p

[Wildman]

So that means I will fill up my inventory half an hour through normal instead of ten minutes into the game as in TQ. :p

Lol, I here that :D

Nice work so far and +1 for the 4th bag

[The Fallen One]

I am absolutely loving the artwork on these new inventory boxes. +1 for the blood spatters, makes it look more like your inventory is actually on you.

[Pvt_Ryan]

we made the decision to increase the size of the UI windows so that at 1024x768 they will be flush with the top of the screen and the top of the HUD toolbar.

It's 2010 could we not assume the default/minimum size is 1280x1024? Anyone with less than that should be forced to upgrade.

[Renevent]

Actually according to the steam hardware surveys, 1280X1024 is still the most popular resolution.

As long as it scales up I think it will be fine :cool:

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/

[Pvt_Ryan]

Actually according to the steam hardware surveys, 1280X1024 is still the most popular resolution.

As long as it scales up I think it will be fine :cool:

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/

I just said that.. :/

[Renevent]

*edit*

I failed to read lol...medierra said 1024X768 not 1280X1024.

Still, 1024X768 is also a very popular resolution people play with (10%)...it seems like the a good baseline so the game supports people on less powerful systems.

[Pvt_Ryan]

It's a horrid baseline as we have moved so much further on.. The only reason I am still on 1280x1024 is because games support it. I would upgrade as soon as they stop making games that support it or I can justify it to the missus which ever comes 1st..

Of those steam stats, aprox 20% of users are < 1280x1024, but assuming only 5% of those would buy this game it's not much of a loss but what you get is less work for the devs (less textures to make) and nicer eye candy tailored for larger screens..

You can get a 22" for less that £160
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-075-LG&groupid=17&catid=949&subcat=

(as an example not a recommendation)

[SoulSeekkor]

It's 2010 could we not assume the default/minimum size is 1280x1024? Anyone with less than that should be forced to upgrade.

Umm...no? I'm just happy with my 1360x768 resolution, there's no reason to *have* to have something like that for a baseline as long as you can change it via the options anyway. I don't really see the point in bringing it up when it was changeable in TQ/IT? I'd much rather stick with my 27" HDTV for a monitor then be forced to "upgrade" to a smaller screen that supports a higher resolution, or pay a fortune for a 27" computer monitor. Most people upgrade their computers, at least gamers...monitors tend to come last in line when it comes to essential hardware for gaming.

Soul

[heron]

Isn't 24" LCD monitors the norm now? It used to be 15,17,19,22.
My 24 can go as high as 1920x1200, yay me *hi fives*

[ASYLUM101]

I'm using a 21.5" widescreen monitor, resolution goes up to 1920 x 1080

[ZZSmufa]

1280x1024 is a horrible abomination of a resolution, and should have never existed. I hardly doubt it makes any difference in textures if the minimum resolution is 1024x768 vs 1280.

[MadWasp]

1280x1024 is a horrible abomination of a resolution, and should have never existed. I hardly doubt it makes any difference in textures if the minimum resolution is 1024x768 vs 1280.

I use 1280 * 1024.......and it's okay.:D

[heron]

Are third world countries still stuck on 15" monitors?

[officerdonnz]

I have a 21.5" widescreen monitor and I use 1024 x 768. :) I find anything much higher than that and I can't see so well what's on the screen as my eyesight isn't that great.

[ASYLUM101]

I have a 21.5" widescreen monitor and I use 1024 x 768. :) I find anything much higher than that and I can't see so well what's on the screen as my eyesight isn't that great.

Glasses help. :)

[officerdonnz]

Glasses help. :)

That they do. And that's with me wearing my reading glasses. :)

[Kardiophylax]

DVI to HDMI adapter connection to a 50" TV. Try it, it works :)

[officerdonnz]

Heh, alright if you have a 50 inch telly. :)

[Code187]

22 screen 1650X1080 or is it 1680X1050 cant remember, any way it is my max rasolution :-)

[alexei]

Are third world countries still stuck on 15" monitors?

Yes there is.

I think it's still relevant to support at least starting with 1024x768.

[MadWasp]

Are third world countries still stuck on 15" monitors?

Hungary is in the middle of Europe.


Europe is for you a third world continent?
Geography is your favourite subject isn't it?

[eisprinzessin]

MadWasp - I think you totally misunderstood heron. He just raised his concern, that Developing Nations are lagging behind our technology standards.

[MadWasp]

MadWasp - I think you totally misunderstood heron. He just raised his concern, that Developing Nations are lagging behind our technology standards.

Maybe I misunderstood. Anyway I'm waiting for heron reply.....

[eisprinzessin]

BTW - the new screenshots (http://www.grimdawn.com/media_screenshots.php) seem to have a 5:4 ratio whereas the previous ones have 4:3 ... if someone donated Crate a 1280x1024 screen, so that could replace one of their 15'' monitors with it? :p

Edit: OK, I'm silly! Firefix's tool tips display 1024x768 (4:3 ratio) for the new screens and 1024x640 (8:5 ... er, that's called 16:10 ratio) for the old ones.

[Pvt_Ryan]

Well I did order my legendary key yesterday so perhaps they used that.. :P

[Opal Monkey]

Umm...no? I'm just happy with my 1360x768 resolution, there's no reason to *have* to have something like that for a baseline as long as you can change it via the options anyway. I don't really see the point in bringing it up when it was changeable in TQ/IT? I'd much rather stick with my 27" HDTV for a monitor then be forced to "upgrade" to a smaller screen that supports a higher resolution, or pay a fortune for a 27" computer monitor. Most people upgrade their computers, at least gamers...monitors tend to come last in line when it comes to essential hardware for gaming.

Soul

I also think 1024x768 is still a relevant resolution. Up until a few months ago when I sprung for a new monitor, I was still using a 19" non-widescreen. I always used 1024x768, not because I didn't have everything I needed to use a higher resolution, but I simply like having things a little larger... and yes, I can see fine, I wear contacts. I'm also not obsessed with squeezing out the best possible graphics... Wait, that makes it sound like I don't like good graphics... hmm...

Even now with my 23" widescreen I still use 1280x768 on Windows and just a notch up on games. I think it's a personal choice, or requirement, for whatever reason each person has. That means it should be supported.

On a side note, I like games that have native support for dual monitors (Supreme Commander is the only one I have). But I don't think I would appreciate it if I was suddenly told that a new game required two monitors! Even if it would enhance aspects of it. I like having the option to use two, but I don't like being forced. I think it's similar with resolutions.

That makes me wonder what Grim Dawn would be like with inventory and stats optionally on a second monitor?

Also love the latest Inventory Screen! And the 4th bag!

[Harlequin]

Here is my theory about the boxes. I dont think I am too far off.
What do you say medierra?^^

[yerkyerk]

With all those jewelry slots, I can dress my toon up like B.A. Baraccus http://forum.jexx.nl/images/smilies/BA.gif

[alexei]

Nice guess. Try reading this. maybe you couldn't find it with all the lot of post counts.
http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6240&postcount=18

[yerkyerk]

I didn't even read that, heh. The mesh-replacing armor sounds interesting.

[Harlequin]

oh I didnt know they already kind of confirmed all slots.^^
well at least I wasn' too far off. :P

I dont quite understand that armor-thingy...

[yerkyerk]

As I understand it, in TQ, the character actually wore the armor (it was put around the torso). Now they just remove the torso entirely and replace it with the armor piece you're wearing.

Not sure if that's the case though. If there's armor that doesn't cover the entire torso, they have to incorporate part of the torso in the armor. And that can cause problems when allowing players to choose different skin colors (although they could probably work in a layer which adjusts the skin color part of the armor to that of the character's skin).

[alexei]

As I understand it, in TQ, the character actually wore the armor (it was put around the torso). Now they just remove the torso entirely and replace it with the armor piece you're wearing.

Not sure if that's the case though. If there's armor that doesn't cover the entire torso, they have to incorporate part of the torso in the armor. And that can cause problems when allowing players to choose different skin colors (although they could probably work in a layer which adjusts the skin color part of the armor to that of the character's skin).

Really? I'm not aware of this. I guess I don't understand much of that mesh talk.

[Shock Trooper]

Things I can see:
Helm: top middle
Belt: bottom middle
Rings: left and right of belt
Boots: bottom left
Gloves: bottom right
Wrist/elbow: above gloves
Armor: mid left
Weapon 1: top left
Weapon 2: top right

How was that?

[3B0L4]

So, let me get this straight:

There is going to be far less clutter loot to pick up.
There is going to be over twice the amount of space in your inventory.

I'm no game designer, nor do i have the aspiration to be, but more isn't always better. With such a big inventory it could be very boring to collect stuff, as you don't really have even the slightest feeling with the stuff you pick up.
What I like about ARPG's vs MMORPG's is that you don't have the feeling of being a simple mercenary, searching for 10 Troll toes or something like that, but you are an important person in the story that unfolds. You fight to get better gear, but as the clutter on the floor (which will be solved) and the clutter in the inventory expands, the feeling of uniqueness could drown out at the start of the game.

The recurring visits to shops gave me a short break between the hacking and slashing. Shops could have great items too, you bought potions, etc.

Or is there going to be some sort of charms like in diablo 2 LoD?

[Scryer]

Hey Medierra, I just wanted to comment on the new bags idea / addition to the inventory. Now, I hate, and I generally do not like arguing against things that make it easier for the player to collect items. I really don’t enjoy it but I have to at least, mention how I feel about it.

Basically, adding different sections or partitions to the inventory screen just feels overwhelming. I imagine a scenario where, while playing I’ve filled every last bit of inventory space (all 4 bags if you will) then unloading all those items either into a stash or selling them. This just seems to me like it would take a while to accomplish. But the larger problem is it makes me feel like we’ll be drowning in loot. It also takes away that feeling of deciding what’s important to pick up. I large enough inventory will cause that.

The reason I love to play these kinds of games is because they are short-action filled adventures. The loot is an added reward for being a part of the action. I realize we all play for different reason, some people are pack-rats and love the loot. But in terms of game design, I almost feel like there should be a choice for the player to make.

With enough inventory space it can feel comfortable to the player. Like they have plenty of time to kill the hoards of monsters vs. acquiring loot and not running out of room. But there comes a point when it can feel overwhelming; especially in an ARPG as traditional as this one. Essentially, with enough inventory space, it becomes less of a choice and more of a chore.

Psychologically speaking, you’re talking about giving the player an abundance of inventory space; it’s like telling the player to loot everything for the sake of looting everything. I almost feel that this type of system would be better if you had 2 – 3 bag types, rather then full-blown inventories.

I must sound crazy, I know, but I just already imagine playing the game, with 4 bags, and just looting everything for the money, and for what’s necessary. I just don’t think that these games are meant to be played like that.

I’ve always felt that picking up loot was a choice, is it worth the space to sell, or is it worth the space to keep for later use? Having an overly large inventory just takes that feeling away, it’s like “I could easily fit all that loot in my inventory, so I might as well.”

I feel that you should try to look for different ways to keep the player away from town. Like having the ability to sell gear on the field, or repair gear on the field. These kinds of mechanics would preserve a smaller inventory without the need to make it overwhelmingly big.

As for different types of inventory bags, I think that could work out. A bag just for crafting materials, and a bag just for trinkets or completed crafts. Things like that won’t necessarily cause the player to be overwhelmed by the enormity of their inventory, but will help to categorize their items in a way that allows for efficiency.

I know, I sound crazy, insane, dumb, whatever you want to think, but I just can’t shake the feeling that a large inventory is just bigger then it needs to be. I’m all for ways to allow the player to be in the field more often, but I just don’t feel that an enormous inventory is the best way to go about that.

I know pack-rats and the like will not concur, but I just wanted to get my opinion on the matter out of the way.

So please – think of other ways to allow the player to stay on the field, but for the sake of brevity, make the inventory size smaller (no bag expansions, or maybe just types of bags for specific item types).

I hope any of this makes sense… If you got this far, you’re a trooper.

TL: DR = Having 3-4 bags (extra inventory screens) feels too overwhelming and not in the same mold of picking and choosing what’s important to you. There should be other mechanics implemented to keep the player in the field without having to visit the town. Having different types of bags would be acceptable as well. I hate suggesting this, but it’s a view that I have and wanted to share it. Thanks...

[3B0L4]

Yep, as i've said in my post, and scryer said, Increasing the amount of inventory directly influences the impact of the loot.

I was thinking though, that there could be some differentiation in what bag is used for what purpose:

The big bag for all loot.
Small bag for relics, charms, potions.
One bag for the loot you want to keep. You could transfer it from the big bag to this.

This way you have a bag with stuff you want to sell, and there could be some button that says 'sell all'.

[medierra]

Meh, I wouldn't be worried about the player inventory becoming overly large just yet. I think it has expanded to a much more comfortable level but you can still fill it up fairly quickly if you're picking up everything.

[Scryer]

I'll take your word for it Medierra, I'm just glade you know how I feel about overly large inventories is all. ^_^

Thanks for the reply also.

[3B0L4]

Could you assign one bag as a relic-bag? Or automatically let potions go to a specified bag?

[Scryer]

Size-Suggestion Update*

I'm going to suggest new sizes...

Item - Horizontal X Vertical

Head - 1x2

Chest - 2x2

Shoulders - 2x1 (Notice same size as waist)

Hands - 1x2 (Show one glove)

Waist - 2x1 (Same size as Shoulders)

Legs - 2x2

Feet - 1x2 (Show one boot)

Small Weapons - 1x2

Large Weapons - 2x2

Shields - 1x2

With a Maximum of 2 sizes, and a minimum of one, you could easily make a small inventory size look really big, and still have a few differing sizes.

I'm starting to feel anything x3 and bigger is just unnecessary. x3 Horizontal is especially a no-no, but x3 as a vertical is less divisive, however, I'm beginning to feel it's not needed. 1x1, 1x2, 2x1, and 2x2, are just fine in my humble opinion.

I realize that sizes should matter, but when it comes to a game, I think the output should be weighed slightly more heavily on what is fun versus what is cumbersome. I would say differing sizes is fun, but can be cumbersome, thus, this is one of the best (but not only) solution I can think of.

[Aesir Rising]

I would either want the icon and inventory representation of an item to be clear and detailed enough to look good - like a model of the item in question - or not be clear and detailed and just be a 1x1 abstract representation.

So, please, either go full-out on the modeling of the item in the inventory with everything from 1x1 to 2x4 sizes depending upon the item size and shape or just give up on that and do abstract icons where everything is the same size (i.e., 1x1).

Arbitrarily limiting everything to smaller than 2x2 is exactly the middle-of-the-road that serves neither purpose very well. The items are too small to be well-drawn and represented to look good, and yet still take up more screen real-estate than a 1x1 abstraction.

I say *all* of this without getting into whether we're getting enough vault storage or not. I don't know if those limits have been set yet. I'm just saying that larger inventory icons and a larger variety of dimensions reflecting the actual items would be better - otherwise just do 1x1 abstract icons.

[Scryer]

Yes, but the larger you go, the more cumbersome the system gets, thus it's good to have a middle ground, IE. 1x1, 1x2, 2x1, and 2x2.

Unfortunately in this type of system, anything x3 and above distorts the inventory in a way that makes it less fun. This is due to the cumbersome-ness nature of the system.

x2 is sufficient for representation of an item, I presume the full art will be shown when it's applied to the correct inventory slot.

[ASYLUM101]

x2 is sufficient for representation of an item, I presume the full art will be shown when it's applied to the correct inventory slot.

Not really - I don't want to see retarded itty bitty WoW-like icons for armor. x2 barely shows anything, and if you suggest that they make 2 separate icons, one for the inventory and one for the equips, go away! Twice as much work for pretty much nothing in return? pff

The inventory space is going to be larger in GD, the large armors smaller (I think medierra said 2x3 instead of 2x4 somewhere) not to mention a muuuch larger bank.

[hooby]

Oh that boxes you're talking about.

At first I thought you'd probably mean these boxes:
http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/image.php?u=1&dateline=1269288448
err...
I mean "crates"...

^^

[Aity]

+1 to the UI

+1 to Scyer's long dissertation on the cons of an enlarged inventory space, and extra +1 for his alternative suggestion for added bag space (effective and simple)

+1 to variable sized items

-1 to have no polearms and staves (big time bummer for me, but I'll deal)

And a single final idiotic rumination....are you going to have a single color/design scheme for the UI for all classes/race/gender/whatevercomboispossible or will there be variations based on either preset design schemes or class/race/gender/etc combos?

I know, stupid question, but I thought I'd ask it anyway.:rolleyes:

[Flamusiptheranji]

multiple personalities need avenues in forums too I'm sure :D

Yes, we all just need to be loved. :P

[Flamusiptheranji]

....Anyway, the good news for the character screen is that it now has 288 inventory grid units including the 3 add-on bags (and we might try to squeeze in a 4th) as compared to TQ's 180. Zomg!

288! WOOT!!! You guys never cease to amaze at making our lives more enjoyable and Grim Dawn more loved. ARPG heaven here we come.

[accelerator]

Stuff about large inventories are bad

I'm curious to what your playing style is like. The smaller the inventory, the more you're having to take constant breaks in combat to compare items and decide whats worth keeping (before we even get to selling back in town). Am I reading this right that this is your preferred playstyle?

To each their own but I prefer to have a long sesion of combat followed by a break to work the grey matter on loot keep/sell decisions.

Finally how does this impact on your opinion of storage space as to me it seems closely tied to your opinion of 'cheapening' loot by having too much space. Can I use a strawman here with vanilla D2 with no mules as one of the more extreme examples which would mean you could either:

a) pick a set item and stick to finding the rest of the set religiously (ie fat chance)
b) read up on all possible relic/charm uses and just find a couple to stick to (ie no testing out of ideas just stick to max damage/defence)
c) have only 1 set with uniquely interesting stats to test a random build/playstyle (to the detriment of having assured damage/defence gear/relics/charms)
d) stick to saving the best cookie cutter damage/defence gear

Most people will go for option d, I don't see the benefit in limiting peoples options to play around with stuff thats in the game. It would be like having a skill tree with 40 skills but you only have enough points for 4 and no resets either. Expansive inventory/storage space gives people a chance to play around with stuff without fear instead of being forced into a cookie cutter looting decision ruleset, unless your Einstein and can evaluate all the pros and cons of every item stat instantly.

[wajld]

That evil laugh ;D looks great

[Snoofo]

So I take it no 'bracers'/arm equipment?

[eisprinzessin]

What makes you think so? It's from 2011, but here is a screenshot of a merchant shop, where you see him offering three gloves (http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showthread.php?p=50774&highlight=gloves#post50774). They include the bracer part. Or were you looking for extra bracers?
http://www.grimdawn.com/screenshots/2011-07-27_newinventory01_sml.jpg (http://www.grimdawn.com/screenshots/2011-07-27_newinventory01_lrg.jpg)
For more recent art, please see Grim Misadventure #12: Fashion Nonsense
http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=357&stc=1&d=1355700923

[Snoofo]

Thanks eis but yes I meant a seperate slot for them (to get more stats/buffs). But that's fine because there is two extra mini slots so we're up one. :D

On a side note, not meaning to judge (but I am lol), are those screen shots in really low res or something or is that how everything will look in game? :undecided:

[eisprinzessin]

Not 100% sure, what you mean, but you are referring to the more recent 2nd image, aren't you?

I don't know if taking the screenshot reduced the quality. Maybe the items need some nice lighting in the inventory screen, too.

[Snoofo]

Second image is fine.

The first image on the other hand, just looks like really low-res graphics and the words/letters in the stats column look really old school like they're not finished? lol

Hey if you're still around, tell me what you thought of my feelings about the camera movement. Please :p

http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showthread.php?p=84923#post84923

[eisprinzessin]

The first screenshot is almost two years old - that's why I referred to the recent art from December.

[Snoofo]

A very happy customer then.

I can't wait to see how useful all the items can be. How powerful the affixes are etc and on what items. :D

[DeMasked]

Btw from what I see it doesn't look like bracers are actually an item. Above the gloves slot looks like the slot for shoulder pads. However the look of the chest piece seems to be able to cover the defensive areas that a bracer might add to. So at least their is that.

Also their are other several other slots which will add more diversity so even if we do lose the "bracer" slot their will be others that may very well be better.

[Snoofo]

Yea as bad as it is not having an item for your forearms, the gloves are designed longer to cover that area. Plus there are more items in other slots to compensate so is not all bad.

Just don't want a possible slot to go to waste. lol I also feel there are stats that should only appear (or appear in greater numbers) on items on arms/hands like dexterity or attack rating etc.