How many Kills?

[medierra]

Hey guys,

I'm going to be looking at the pacing of experience / leveling again soon and I was thinking it would be helpful to have some numbers for comparison to TQ. Could you please your stats for char level, number of kills, deaths and time played for whatever characters you have? I want to get a good sampling of different levels though, so I'd like to see low, mid, and high-level characters.

Try to keep it concise and just post the relevant stats so that it isn't too tough to read through. If you have a ton of deaths, I don't need to know why, we can just assume you went off to have lunch while standing next to a respawn fountain, surrounded by dactyls. You can also just skip posting deaths if you want, that is less important.

Also, if anyone happens to feel like compiling all the stats people post into a single post, that would be greatly appreciated. :p

EDIT - In response to eisprinzessin's questions: TQ or TQ:IT chars, no mods. Thanks!

[eisprinzessin]

Would you like to know the Class, too? Does it matter, if we played the original TQ or TQ:IT with a character? Or if we imported one from TQ to TQ:IT to continue? Can we include characters, which we created for map mods like Lilith? How about characters which we used for difficulty mods like xMax, Uber and Achilles? I assume that we shall leave out mastery-mod characters.

Edit: I played with Google Docs and created a form for us to submit char stats. This way medierra has the data already collected in a spreadsheet. Let me know about any issues.

Submit your data (https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/embeddedform?formkey=dEpUTDRldlNpdTlfZjlxX0VrZTV3N UE6MQ)
View spreadsheet (https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AvnbhLnV5QOSdEpUTDRldlNpdTlfZjlxX0VrZTV3N UE&hl=en_US#gid=0)

[TECHNOmancer]

If you have a ton of deaths, I don't need to know why, we can just assume you went off to have lunch while standing next to a respawn fountain, surrounded by dactyls.

I'll have you know that those were LEGENDARY dactyls!! :D

I have my entire character roster listed in an Excel spreadsheet (call me anal retentive but I have to organize information systematically when I've got 39 of them). I'll either send the document to you or post a portion of it here.

TECHNOmancer

[eisprinzessin]

Tested my form and entered my four vanilla chars.

[ASYLUM101]

While my entries are TQIT - they are also XMAX, massboss runs, and achilles runs... 882 deaths was from AFK for a few hours where there were like 500000 anourans.

[medierra]

Awesome idea with the google spreadsheet! Definitely makes this much easier. :)

I only care about deaths from the perspective of understanding possibly discrepancies between number kills and level.

Unfortunately, the level of enemies people are fighting can vary significantly depending on the pace of a person's progress through the game, so that is an unknown factor.

[nighteyes]

Well I put mine up on the spread sheet, however, if you don't enter a number for the days and go straight to the hours it adds the zero on at the end, meaning that my Lv 6 seer has been played for only 1h and 8 minutes, not 1day and 8h.;)

I've sent you a PM about it eisprinzessin.

[mamba]

OK, entered my chars, which just goes to show that I spent a lot of time in the game ;)

Looking at the stats, my Soothsayer is an outlier, I blame it on endless Typhon runs (thought that was mostly my Oracle though..) ;) don't think I edited him tho... he certainly legitimately finished TQ legendary, but never really did anything in IT

[eisprinzessin]

Thanx for using it. nighteyes, I fixed your entry.

[i.n.s.a.n.e]

I will post mine as soon as I get back home from work..if it is still relevant. =)

Anyway, what exactly do you need it for Medierra? Just curious how it will help you. Thanks. =)

[eisprinzessin]

Fill in the form ;)

[Opal Monkey]

I started sifting through my characters ready to start filling the form out... when I realized I don't have the slightest clue which ones I've used xMax on.

There are only three I can be sure are free of mods. They have been entered.

Mmm... Love the smell of tabulated data after midnight :D

[matthewfarmery]

Posted my two classes, hope the infomation helps you in some way, but also curious on what you are going to use the formation for?

[Hrf]

I posted my three characters. Not sure if this makes any difference, but the second and the third character (brigand and prophet) used A LOT of the equipment found by the first char, so their total time to get to the same level would probably be much shorter. Maybe that's something that should be taken into consideration.

[yerkyerk]

I don't think I have my older characters anymore... my stats are borked anyway.

I used to play hardcore on vanilla TQ, which means I'd average slightly less than 1 death per character. And relying heavily on pets, I didn't get many kills (in TQ, kills made by pets weren't added to the killcounter for some weird reason).

[i.n.s.a.n.e]

Well, my data included.

The only completely mods-clean char is the Warden, the other two, I am not sure if I used any mods.. =/ Hopefully not..I farmed bosses a lot with them, that's why the high lvl and low kill count.

[Harlequin]

Maybe it would help to write down the game-progress.
Difficulty and Act. that way you could eliminate some uncertainties about the pace and it would explain stuff like these:
Level: 48 Kills: 27773
Level: 54 Kills: 25671

I guess number two was a bit quicker with starting Epic and Legendary.

Edit: I would like to post as well but none of my chars are mod-clean.

[eisprinzessin]

I asked the guys on TQ.net to provide some data, too: Help for Grim Dawn wanted (http://www.titanquest.net/tq-forum/threads/40638-Help-for-Grim-Dawn-wanted). There should be more players, who have their data at hand and have played without mods.

[DOOMER]

As long as it doesnt boil down to doing baal runs 100-300 times to go from hard to very hard, or perhaps normal to hard, then im happy.

I never played titan quest so i have no idea how the leveling works, but please dont make it like diablo 2. that games leveling is trash. And like i said earlier, as much as we loved that game, it really wasnt that good in the first place.

[eisprinzessin]

As we collect the data separately, it is probably save to have a discussion here. Well, DOOMER, I never played Diabolo - so I have no idea, what is so bad with Diabolo's system. In TQ you can simple move forward and proceed to the next difficulty without any extra farming and levelling.

But I was not satisfied with how the levelling was paced. My experience was: complete TQ:IT on Normal at about level 40, Epic at about 55 and Legendary at about 62. Normal was inflationary, whereas Legendary was quite tedious. A better pacing would have been: complete Normal at 30, Epic at 50 and Legendary at 65.

[psisci]

But I was not satisfied with how the levelling was paced. My experience was: complete TQ:IT on Normal at about level 40, Epic at about 55 and Legendary at about 62. Normal was inflationary, whereas Legendary was quite tedious. A better pacing would have been: complete Normal at 30, Epic at 50 and Legendary at 65.

for me it was N39 , E 54 ,L63, and i did run the games onec from the start to the end ( no farming runs) so it did feel that legenfdry was more chalanging but it was slow progress in legendary both in Exp and time .

[jiaco]

A better pacing would have been: complete Normal at 30, Epic at 50 and Legendary at 65.

Not sure about the numbers exactly, but I agree with the sentiment wholeheartedly. There was an additional issue with TQ, high level toons were basically farming for loot, not XP. Leveling means less and less the higher you go. I realize this is a tough problem, but how impossible would it be to have Epic and Legendary only skills that make you still want to just level up one more level for more than just equipping gear.

For me TQ is best in normal for leveling to acquire skills, which is great, but the gear is kinda flat when compared to Epic and beyond. But once that character development is basically over, just putting more points into the skills that are already chosen by that toon, the interest in progression seriously wanes. (at least IMO)

[Josho]

I like the idea of epic and legendary skills to keep the character development fresh and interesting. As much as I like my higher level characters, I really have no desire to level them up, especially when that experience bar creeps up a millimetre at a time. If I do feel a need to level them up, I have to set a goal of aiming for a particular notch on the experience bar.

Should it really be like that?

The only way I got around it was to use xMax and run some highly populated areas. As such, I can not actually submit any characters myself; considering I have a level 64 character with 104,369 kills... He was my first toon I took past Act 2 normal and had to build him up.

[medierra]

I totally understand what you guys are saying. I actually just had to purchase TQ / TQIT on Steam because I wanted to play it a bit for reference and during my last move I misplaced my original copy.

Anyway, I have to admit, I find it very difficult to play TQ now after playing GD. The pacing seems very slow, the combat dynamic is kind of tedious, and the loot early on is very flat and uninteresting as you say. :o

I feel like we need to hurry up and get GD done just to provide you with some relief! :p

[jiaco]

You sir are the MAN!

(although the part about having to buy your own game is sort of sad)

[pts]

(although the part about having to buy your own game is sort of sad)

+1

---------<character limit>---------

[matthewfarmery]

sounds like GD will be a zillion times better

but yeah, you shouldn't have had to buy your own game, but at least there is a difference in pacing, and I also agree that TQ was fairly slow, so can't wait to get my teeth into GD
with each day passing, the excitement to play it mounts

but I do see the need to compare both games, hopefully a trip down memory lane has proven useful

[Harlequin]

Well you know what that means medierra: You have to release a demo for the alpha asap!!!!
No seriously sounds like GD will be even more awesome than we expected. Can't wait.

[hooby]

As long as it doesnt boil down to doing baal runs 100-300 times to go from hard to very hard, or perhaps normal to hard, then im happy.

I never played titan quest so i have no idea how the leveling works, but please dont make it like diablo 2. that games leveling is trash. And like i said earlier, as much as we loved that game, it really wasnt that good in the first place.

Diablo's difficulty was ramped up patch for patch for patch. Which in the end lead to that effect that you describe - there was some sort of noticable gap inbetween the different difficulties.

But in the early days (I played D2 starting day one) it wasn't like this - the switch from one difficulty to the next was very smooth and caused no problems at all.

They ramped up the difficulty to cater to the very hardcore players. Which kinda makes sense to do at a time when everyone except the most hardcore fans stopped playing D2 a long time ago.

[hooby]

I went and made some mastery statistics:

Masteries by usage:
1. warfare: 26 chars (13.9%)
2. dream: 25 chars (13.4%)
3. defense: 23 chars (12.3%)
4. hunting: 22 chars (11.8%)
5. spirit: 21 chars (11.2%)
6. earth: 20 chars (10.7%)
7. rogue: 18 chars (9.6%)
8. storm: 17 chars (9.1%)
9. nature: 15 chars (8.0%)

Masteries by combined character levels:
1. warfare: 1186 levels (16.4%)
2. defense: 978 levels (13.5%)
3. dream: 921 levels (12.8%)
4. spirit: 824 levels (11.4%)
5. hunting: 817 levels (11.3%)
6. earth: 747 levels (10.3%)
7. rogue: 630 levels (8.7%)
8. storm: 594 levels (8.2%)
9. nature: 521 levels (7.2%)

Masteries by combined kills:
1. warfare: 944131 kills (22.1%)
2. defense: 609098 kills (14.3%)
3. dream: 541090 kills (12.7%)
4. hunting: 479485 kills (11.2%)
5. spirit: 433219 kills (10.1%)
6. earth: 420621 kills (9.8%)
7. rogue: 337309 kills (7.9%)
8. storm: 313616 kills (7.3%)
9. natue: 195463 kills (4.6%)

Masteries by days played total:
1. warfare: 54.3 days (14.3%)
2. spirit: 49.1 days (13.0%)
3. earth: 47.7 days (12.6%)
4. hunting: 46.4 days (12.3%)
5. defense: 45.7 days (12.1%)
6. rogue: 38.1 days (10.1%)
7. dream: 36.1 days (9.5%)
8. storm: 32.1 days (8.5%)
9. nature: 28.9 days (7.6%)

and now for the interesting stuff:

Masteries by levels per day
1. dream: 25.5 lvl/day
2. warfare: 21.8 lvl/day
3. defense: 21.4 lvl/day
4. storm: 18.5 lvl/day
5. nature: 18.0 lvl/day
6. hunting: 17.6 lvl/day
7. spirit: 16.8 lvl/day
8. rogue: 16.5 lvl/day
9. earth: 15.7 lvl/day
AVERAGE: 19.1 lvl/day

Masteries by kills per minute:
1. warfare: 12.1 kpm
2. dream: 10.2 kpm
3. defense: 9.3 kpm
4. hunting: 7.2 kpm
5. storm: 6.8 kpm
6. rogue: 6.2 kpm
7. spirit: 6.1 kpm
earth: 6.1 kpm
9. nature: 4.7 kpm
AVERAGE: 7.6 kpm

Please note that this statistics are very inaccurate, because the data-set (about 100 characters) is much too small.

[eisprinzessin]

Awesome - and it should be good enough to show tendencies. But you need to read kills/minute carefully:
And relying heavily on pets, I didn't get many kills (in TQ, kills made by pets weren't added to the killcounter for some weird reason).
That's why Earth and Nature ended up at the bottom. Look at mamba's (row 20) and my (row 5) Conjurers. Our pets nicked about 10k-15k kills.

[Cavar]

I feel like we need to hurry up and get GD done just to provide you with some relief! :p

Yes, please! :D

[matthewfarmery]

Yes, please! :D

I second that

[i.n.s.a.n.e]

Anyway, I have to admit, I find it very difficult to play TQ now after playing GD. The pacing seems very slow, the combat dynamic is kind of tedious, and the loot early on is very flat and uninteresting as you say. :o

I feel like we need to hurry up and get GD done just to provide you with some relief! :p

Good news here. =)

I am glad to hear the pacing has changed since TQ days. I also love your status on early loot! =)

[rodnocle]

I like the idea of epic and legendary skills to keep the character development fresh and interesting. As much as I like my higher level characters, I really have no desire to level them up, especially when that experience bar creeps up a millimetre at a time. If I do feel a need to level them up, I have to set a goal of aiming for a particular notch on the experience bar.

Should it really be like that?
i think thats the biggest problem of all rpg's

(what was really rewarding/motivating in TQ was that when you finished epic/legendary and went back to the standard level
you saw how strong the char has gotten wehn the easy enemys flew through the level :D)


i posted my char stats, i played at least 4 chars to lvl 30-65 but i dont remember the exact stats.

[medierra]

Thank you all for the assistance in gathering this information, I think it shall prove quite useful as a reference. :D

[Bleh]

Added my stats aswell.

Sorry for the late addition but I had to install the game again. Yes yes I know that's bad but over the years I lost a few too many good items which I thought I had backupped. So I couldn't bring it over me to start again but now that I have installed it again .......... .